Spreading lump on rabbit cheek? (Please help!!)

Discussion in 'Health & Wellness' started by Louise1710, Nov 26, 2018.

Help Support Rabbits Online by donating:

  1. Nov 26, 2018 #1

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2018
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    London
    Hi, I was wondering if anyone could help me with a diagnosis of some sort? Basically 2 months ago my 5 year old Netherland Dwarf developed a sudden red lump on his nose. We thought it could be burn from the radioactive as he likes to be near them or some sort of sore so we put some sudocrem on. After a week we noticed it was getting larger so we took him to a vet who said he’s sure it’s myxomatos and there’s nothing he can do and gave us some isaderm which helped with the swelling. The isaderm didn’t really stop the spreading just the swelling and redness, I done some research on myxomatos and I was sure it wasn’t what he had, he was still him usual self showing no signs of pain or illness and the lump was very red as opposed to grey lumps I had seen with the photos of myxomatosis. After the cream ran out we returned to a different vet and he had a look. At first look he said it’s definitely not myxo. I asked about dental problems or an abscess because I know they are very common in this area, he tried to squeeze it and he said it’s hard so he thinks it’s a tumour and they can test it but it will be very expensive. He prescribed antibiotics which had no affect and I did some more research. I read online abscesses are usually hard because rabbit pus has a thick consistency, and they are so common on the cheek area whereas a tumor on the face is rare. I have no idea what to do as the vet wouldn’t even look in his mouth. I managed to get some more isaderm but it’s now rapidly spreading. Some days it’s really crusty but sometime it’s moist and it was bleeding the other day where he is excessively cleaning it. He doesn’t seem in pain and is his normal self, but I have noticed now he having trouble chewing and one nostril is very small from the swelling so something needs to be done ASAP!! I spoke to another vet who said they can do an anaesthetic and look in his mouth but still so expensive and I’m low on money and paid a lot for 2 vets to tell me they’re not sure. So want to be certain of what it possibly could be before I go ahead. Please tell me your thoughts of if you have seen anything similar. I also have another rabbit and she is absolutely fine so it can’t be anything contagious.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Nov 26, 2018 #2

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    You need to look for a rabbit savvy vet and get him re-examined. There will need to be some diagnostics, they won’t be able to tell you Just from looking - I know it’s expensive but that’s the price you pay for the training and experience that vets have. Maybe they can take a needle biopsy and have a look under the microscope to see if that gives them any ideas, but it could be an abscess, a tumour, or any number of things. No vet would be able to tell you from this photo, and neither will anyone else.
     
  3. Nov 26, 2018 #3

    AmberKoenders

    AmberKoenders

    AmberKoenders

    Member

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2018
    Messages:
    6
    Likes Received:
    3
    Location:
    Netherlands
    Get the bunny to a vet again and get him properly examined and diagnosed.
    What you can do yourself is keeping the area clean by cleaning it very gently with a soft towel and some luke warm water so the area is less irritated. The swelling however won't go away on its own and needs medical attention.

    Please don't take my full word for it as I am just a vet tech in training but..
    Antibiotics did not work it seems (you did finish the anitbiotics as prescribed right?), so this lump is:

    1. Maybe not an infection.
    Then get a scrape or a puncture test (could cost you some money unfortunately, couldn't say how much, but you can ask the vet for an indication) and they can send it to a lab / examine it and then they can find the right solution to the problem. If it is not an infection, a fungus, skin disease or some kind of mite, the only thing it can be is a tumor. And then I am so sorry to say, but the location of the supposed tumor makes it very risky or maybe even impossible to remove, so I don't think there will be anything they can do at that point. If they can, bless you, you have a really skilled vet!


    or 2. The source of the infection is something inside that is untreated.
    This 'something' has pushed this infection as a big lump to the surface. If they put the bunny under anesthesia (in the Netherlands that would cost you about 30-40 euros generally) they can make an xray image of the molars or any other supposed affected parts (about 10-15 euros for each image) to see if anything is wrong in there. So together with a reverser for the anestesia (which I included in the first price) this whole thing would cost you maybe 40+30=70 euros for diagnostics (that would be around 60 pounds). But then you know at least and if there is anything they can do, they can do it now and treat this thing.

    Keep in mind that a bunny can live for 10 years or sometimes more, so if they can treat this thing now, he will still have a many bunny years left to live so you will have a great pet.

    Note: You can check the front teeth yourself. They should line up nicely and close up in the middle. If anything is too long it might hurt and cause an infection. The vet can easily snip away excess front tooth withouth anesthesia. (My vet does this for free even) But I think they would have done that already by now if that were the problem because it is such an easy fix..
    Also when the bunny has trouble eating, it would suggest some heavy pains, and possibly indeed a tooth issue.

    Best of luck with your bunny..
    Lots of love from the Netherlands!
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2018
    Playdoh52 and Louise1710 like this.
  4. Nov 26, 2018 #4

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2018
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    London
    Thank you so much for your detailed reply I really appreciate it!! But I’m in two minds if it could be syphilis or an abscess due to the area.

    I’m thinking it could be syphilis just at the rate it’s spreading and the texture of it, but then again it’s quite swollen and I can feel a lump under his jaw and he’s having trouble eating which I’m not sure if it’s due to the swelling or pain with his teeth as he didn’t have this issue a couple of weeks ago. His front teeth look ok but I can’t look at his molars which is where I think the pain could be. The vet I saw before gave us septrin. Do you know much about this antibiotic being used on rabbits?

    I have found a vets who I think may specialise in rabbits but they have quoted me 180 euros just for the anaesthetic to take a look inside his mouth. Whereas the vet I’m seeing now is considerably cheaper but I feel they don’t know much about rabbit health so thinking I could present him the problems?

    Do you know the differences between a tumor and an abscess? I have tried to look online but I have read tumors on the face are rare so can’t find much information.
     
  5. Nov 26, 2018 #5

    Nancy McClelland

    Nancy McClelland

    Nancy McClelland

    Larry Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 1, 2007
    Messages:
    16,289
    Likes Received:
    1,219
    Location:
    Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
    Check with rescue organizations--they may find you a cheaper, more experienced vet as the one you go to doesn't seem all that good to us.
     
    JBun and Louise1710 like this.
  6. Nov 26, 2018 #6

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    It is impossible to know if it is a tumour or an abscess without them taking a sample of some sort. I would pay more to see a more experienced rabbit vet, or like Larry said speak to a rabbit rescue.
    A lump on the jaw usually signifies dental problems, meaning the other lump could also be related. A proper exam and X-ray would be very very helpful right now.
     
    JBun and Louise1710 like this.
  7. Nov 27, 2018 #7

    JBun

    JBun

    JBun

    Jenny - Health & Wellness Mod Staff Member Administrator Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2012
    Messages:
    8,056
    Likes Received:
    2,133
    Location:
    Utah, , USA
    It's not syphilis, as there isn't swelling like that involved with syphilis. Whether it's an abscess or a tumor, it's likely going to involve xrays, surgery, and meds, which will likely be expensive. So if this isn't something you can afford to have done, then you need to consider what the kindest thing is for your rabbit, so your bun doesn't end up suffering.
    http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Dental_diseases/Treatment/Facial/abs_dental.htm
    http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Cancer/Sarcoma/Fibro/Fibros_en.htm

    But whatever your choice, you definitely need an experienced rabbit vet. Try looking on these lists for a good rabbit vet near you. And get an appointment right away, in fact this is bordering on an emergency appointment at this time.
    https://www.harcourt-brown.co.uk/vetfinder
    https://rabbitwelfare.co.uk/rabbit-care-advice/rabbit-friendly-vets/rabbit-friendly-vet-list/
     
  8. Nov 27, 2018 #8

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    Your profile says you’re in london? The Royal Vet College (in Camden) would be ideal, depending on where you are in London.
     
  9. Dec 3, 2018 #9

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2018
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    London
    Update - so I have just returned from the vet who looked in his mouth, they said it’s nothing to do with his teeth and it must be a tumor and there’s nothing they cans do and advised me to put him to sleep. I have been given some metacam to keep him comfortable but devastated. Any advice?
     
  10. Dec 3, 2018 #10

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    Did they sedate him for that? Can’t do a proper dental exam on a conscious rabbit. If you really are ready to spend some money and get some X-rays etc done then that would be the way to go, but I don’t know how much can be done at this late stage. If you aren’t prepared to put him through that, which I wouldn’t blame you for, then I must agree the kindest thing would be to put him to sleep if you think he is suffering. I’m so sorry for you, it’s never an easy decision.
     
  11. Dec 3, 2018 #11

    sally p2

    sally p2

    sally p2

    New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2018
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    Wgc
    Hi this sounds like an abscess. One of my rabbits had multiple abscesses caused by dental issues. We would get one cleared up and a few months later another would appear.
    They are treatable. We are registered at Medivet. The vet cut the abscess and squeezed out the pus. The pus will need flushing daily at first, but less so as it clears. The vet can fill the hole, once empty with anti biotic cream, which helps more than an oral antibiotic.
    If your rabbit is calm and is able to be held firmly, you can slice the abscess open to avoid an anaesthetic.
    Get to a good vet. Medivet are excellent and were amazing at helping Minky. Don5 just accept that your pet has to be PTS
     
  12. Dec 4, 2018 #12

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    I agree get a good vet, but we absolutely can’t assume it is an abscess at this point - he needs X-rays at least, if not a CT, and a fine needle aspirate/biopsy would all be useful. If you don’t think you have a lot of money for tests/treatment (as you said in your original post) then it is a difficult route to go down, so unless you can maybe set up a payment plan with your vet, it is just best to think about what is best for your bunny.
     
  13. Dec 4, 2018 #13

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    Louise1710

    New Member

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2018
    Messages:
    4
    Likes Received:
    0
    Location:
    London
    No they didn’t even sedate him, they just stuck some metal thing inside his mouth and looked inside. They then stuck a needle in lump and blood came out and he said that means it’s a tumor? The vet I saw is the best in the practice but not entirely rabbit savvy. but this is the third time I’ve been, each time a different vet and they keep advising me to put him sleep but I don’t want to just give up on him. I know it’s selfish but I really don’t want to lose him, I think that’s why I keep exploring different options although I was sure it was an abscess too.
     
  14. Dec 4, 2018 #14

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Popsicles

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2018
    Messages:
    1,107
    Likes Received:
    452
    Location:
    England
    Blood coming out does not mean it is a tumour. I think you need to go to a truly rabbit savvy vet. I see you’re from London, if you have the money it would be great to go to the Royal Vet College in Camden, they have fantastic resources there.
    Or you can look on here:
    https://rabbitwelfare.co.uk/rabbit-care-advice/rabbit-friendly-vets/rabbit-friendly-vet-list/
    You can’t make any decisions without more tests being done, as at the moment it is all just guess work. I would insist for at least an X-ray and a needle biopsy sent to a lab.
     
    JBun likes this.
  15. Dec 4, 2018 #15

    cwebster

    cwebster

    cwebster

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2018
    Messages:
    115
    Likes Received:
    38
    Location:
    Central Coast CA
    Agree that more tests really would let you know what is going on. Some vets know little about rabbits. Could be an abscess or cyst and not necessarily a tumor. Many tumors are not cancer and can just be removed. Would not give up on your bunny.
     
  16. Dec 4, 2018 #16

    CharlieRae

    CharlieRae

    CharlieRae

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2018
    Messages:
    86
    Likes Received:
    20
    Location:
    Wyoming
    I do not recommend letting your vet just slice open this area without a VERY thorough exam. If it is a tumor it could end up worse than it is. You need a vet that has extensive rabbit knowledge. I understand not wanting to just give up on him, I'm the same way with my bunny babies. Look into the resources in your area, many animal organizations have funds for these types of things that they will pay towards the vet bills. I hope everything turns out okay.
     

Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page

Group Builder