Swine Flu Vaccine

[tonyshuman]

It's clear that this discussion is pretty heated, but remember that we're trying to be objective here, not personal. Please don't be offended if someone disagrees with you. Simply asking for more facts is not a personal attack.

As a student in the health sciences, it makes me very worried when people make decisions about their health that are based on irrelevant or false information. I feel it's my duty to share truthful information about these health questions so that everyone can read that info, judge it for themselves, and make a decision that way. For that reason, I recommend that everyone read the FDA link I posted above.

Here's an article from the FDA on H1N1 vaccine safety: http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm182290.htm

One on Gardasil safety, which is not really relevant to this debate but I'll post as well:
http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm179549.htm

Please consider the sources you get information from. There are many websites that try to sensationalize rare cases simply because creating a feeling of panic increases their website traffic and thus their profits from advertisers. The FDA is a government agency that exists to protect the public from unsafe medication and they work very hard to do so. The climate within the pharmaceutical industry (and I have worked in this industry) is very regulated and everything is documented and reported.

If you read good scientific information produced by the FDA, which exists solely to keep us safe, and still don't want to get the vaccine, that's fine for you, but please remember that if you get the disease, you can spread it. Spreading the disease will only make the worldwide situation worse. Widespread vaccination has made some diseases all but disappear in the US, which protects everyone, including those who don't have the money to get a vaccine or aren't in one of the target age groups.

The problem with most of the popular information about vaccines is that it relies heavily on rare cases or things that could be due to a number of factors in the patient's life. This is because people are all different and will respond differently to a drug. You may be the one in 100,000 that has an adverse reaction, that is true. However, the potential benefits of the H1N1 vaccine--not getting sick and missing work, not spreading the virus farther to extend the worldwide pandemic, not spreading the virus to children who are too young to be vaccinated, not spreading the virus to those who aren't on the recommended vaccination list--are great, and the risks are very low. The probability of a major adverse event is very low.

More info on vaccine safety:
http://www.fda.gov/BiologicsBloodVaccines/SafetyAvailability/VaccineSafety/ucm133806.htm

As for long-term safety, seasonal flu vaccines do not have to have the same long-term safety studies that other drugs do; that is true. However, this is because they are needed urgently--manufacturers don't have as much time to go through all the same tests for vaccines that they do for other drugs (or other vaccines) in time to get a seasonal flu vaccine to the public. However, there have been no major reports of long-term seasonal flu effects, and the seasonal flu vaccine has been around for years.

Please make your judgements based on sound scientific information, not sensationalized media coverage. I can respect a decision made on good information.

 

[pamnock]

fuzz16 wrote:

Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

H1N1 is the predominant strain ofinfluenza this season. If you've got the flu, the chances are most likely that it's H1N1.

Influenza mutates continually to overcome natural resistance in hosts. Therefore, new vaccines must be developed every year.

Over 500 children have died from H1N1. If the vaccine were widely available in our area, I'd certainly have my son get the vaccine.

Pam

 

[Orchid]

BethM wrote:

Orchid wrote:

I do not see why you seem so upset. Can not everyone here have an opinion, even if it differs from yours?

and it is related to my response...my feelings on vaccines.



Either which way...I am not concerned enough to find out whatever post mortem information there is because I will not have this nor will my daughter. Should someone more interested in those answers want to look they may do so....but I do not see what is relevant to if I know the answers. I only provided a link and food for thought. Diversity...

You imply that the death is related to the vaccine, but don't even care enough to follow up to find out the final facts in the case? The actual facts are not relevant?
That's fear-mongering.

I never said no one else should have an opinion, but if you're going to scare people you should provide some facts to back up the reasoning.

Because there is a chance it is related. Whether it be because it was a bad dose, bad batch..bad vaccine. Could have to do with the fact you should never get a vaccine if you are already ill , until you become well. Many factors. So much unknown....but how does one find out? By looking? By reading? By asking questions?

I implied nothing. I simply shared the link. The follow up is not relevant for me. and I of course disagree...fear mongering would be to stick ones head in the sand and not bother to look around at all...or perhaps it would be better to be sheep and not question anything...hmmm....

The only way to scare someone with regards to this is if they do not bother to read the whole article...and should they have concerns are they not able to look further into it to begin with?

I am not a news reporter, just someone who watches and takes an interest where something interests me. Sharing that should not have cause this sort of discussion and I no longer care to banter back and forth on an issue you see very black and white with no room for anything else. I dont like being attacked just because I shared something so regardless of your response...I will not reply again.

 

[irishbunny]

I think I'm going to get it. My whole family is getting it on Monday so I might as well just get it. There are a few really wise people on here who support it and, now, from what I can see the advantages of the vaccine really outweigh the risks. Thanks everyone for your opinions :highfive:

 

[Luvmyzoocrew]

i find this topic interesting, i like to see the different sides and what people decide. having read the stuff, i still dont feel comfortable getting certain shots or having my kids get certain shots. I cant believe that formaldehyde, and metals, and the nurmerous other things in shots are good for my kids. Like i said before until the shots are 100 percent affective in fighting what they are vacing for then there are shots that i will not get my family. Grace good luck on monday.

 

[missyscove]

pamnock wrote:

fuzz16 wrote:

Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

H1N1 is the predominant strain ofinfluenza this season. If you've got the flu, the chances are most likely that it's H1N1.

Influenza mutates continually to overcome natural resistance in hosts. Therefore, new vaccines must be developed every year.

Over 500 children have died from H1N1. If the vaccine were widely available in our area, I'd certainly have my son get the vaccine.

Pam

From an article today in my campus newspaper
Gannett is Cornell's campus health center

"As of Nov. 30, 1,628 students have been diagnosed by Gannett with probable H1N1. The highest rates of infection occurred in early September, when the number of students diagnosed with probable H1N1 at Gannett peaked at 103 per day. During the outbreak, 565 students were diagnosed at Gannett with probable H1N1 over a two-week period from Sept. 7 to Sept. 20. During this two-week period, Gannett stopped routine appointments and organized extra staffing in order to deal with the influx of patients. The Interfraternity Council also placed a moratorium on social events during this time to reduce the transmission of the virus. Sadly, this outbreak was also marked by the tragic death of Warren Schor ’11, who passed away from complications related to the virus.
While the number of cases drastically declined following the initial spike, for the past few weeks Gannett has still been diagnosing between 20 and 25 patients per day with probable H1N1. According to the New York State Department of Health, all forms of influenza in New York State area are of the H1N1 strain."


They call them "probable H1N1" because they can't confirm it without sending a sample in to a government lab and the high number of cases means they don't do that unless the person is hospitalized.

 

[Luvmyzoocrew]

Here is an article from a local paper where i am from that basically is stating that all t hese "swine flu" cases may not be swine flu. So if this is happening here it is most likely happening everywhere, so when they are labeling someone with the swine flu and giving these very high numbers of people who have caught the swine flu, the numbers may be WAY OFF. I think due to the media that the swine flu has gotten to be this greater then life thing when if fact it is not much worse then the regular flu, with of course the exception to the rules when it comes to immuno suppressed and such.


http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home...k_is_rhinovirus__not_swine_flu.html?viewAll=y

Ill this fall? Maybe it wasn't swine flu after all By Don Sapatkin
Inquirer Staff Writer
I had swine flu. It is almost a badge of honor, suggesting that the speaker survived the first pandemic of the 21st century and is immune to the next wave.
It also may be wrong.
Tests at Children's Hospital of Philadelphia suggest that large numbers of people who got sick this fall actually fell victim to a sudden, unusually severe - and continuing - outbreak of rhinovirus, better known as a key cause of the common cold.
Experts say it is logistically and financially impossible to test everyone with flulike symptoms. And signs, treatment, and prognoses for a bad cold and a mild flu are virtually identical, so the response hardly differs.
But the finding may send an important message to parents who (despite doctors' recommendations) are questioning the need to immunize their children against swine flu because they seemed to have already had the disease, said Susan Coffin, director of infection prevention and control at Children's Hospital.
"Maybe their child is still susceptible to H1N1 and should still get the vaccine," Coffin said.
For years, rhinoviruses have been the Rodney Dangerfields of microbes. Even major institutions have found plenty of reasons not to pay them much mind. They are exceedingly common, they cause mere colds, they come in hundreds of hard-to-identify strains that make testing a challenge, and there is no effective treatment anyway.
Neither the federal government nor the states track rhinoviruses in the way they do "surveillance" for influenza, based on samplings of doctor diagnoses, emergency-room visits, and lab reports. Children's Hospital of Philadelphia is one of the few institutions that routinely checks for them whenever it tests for influenza and other viruses.
Rhinovirus - named after the Greek word for nose - is known to circulate year-round, and typically to peak shortly before and after flu season. Children's recorded rising numbers in September, right on schedule. Then they kept rising.
"The rate of activity was unbelievably high," Richard L. Hodinka, director of the clinical virology laboratory, said yesterday. "What got my attention was not only the numbers we were seeing in the laboratory, but physicians saying there was severe disease."

'Looking back ...' The hospital alerted the Philadelphia Department of Public Health. The city, citing reports from several labs, issued an advisory for the public-health community Oct. 9. They also asked the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to investigate the outbreak; a CDC team returned to Atlanta last Wednesday after two weeks here but has not finished its analysis.
Meanwhile, people around the region were coming down with flulike illnesses. Two Catholic high schools, Archbishop John Carroll in Radnor and Bishop Shanahan in Downingtown, briefly closedafter a third of the students were absent.
Doctors and hospitals had been expecting and preparing for swine flu. Yet laboratory data indicate that, while swine flu was present in the region as early as mid-September, it did not start to rise sharply until the third week of October.
"When this began happening, we all believed what we were seeing was influenza," said Coffin, speaking both as a physician and as the mother of a 16-year-old Lower Merion student who got sick in the middle of September.
"I went around telling my friends, 'I'm positive she had flu.' And now, looking back, I think she probably had rhinovirus."
Lab positives for rhinovirus at Children's continued at very high levels through October as swine flu also spiked. Emergency-room visits for flulike illness spiraled upward.
The ER was forced to convert part of the hospital's atrium lobby into a waiting area, and visits reached a record Oct. 26. (They have been gradually declining since then, and now are about 20 percent more than normal for this time of year.)
Although most ER patients were not tested, late October coincided with the laboratory's highest numbers for both swine flu and rhinovirus. More than 40 percent of them were the latter.
Besides the sheer numbers of rhinovirus, Coffin was surprised that it was causing more problems - wheezing, pneumonia, fever, and lower-respiratory-tract infections - than are normally associated with the common cold, which typically infects the upper respiratory tract. That has led her to suspect that a strain not seen here before may be responsible. The CDC's lab will attempt to identify the strain.
With no nationwide reporting and few other hospitals routinely testing for rhinovirus, it is difficult to determine whether it is causing similar problems elsewhere. Hodinka, the Children's lab director, said rhinovirus outbreaks generally were not limited to one city; he suspects that this one is occurring in other East Coast cities.
And doctors in Louisville, Ky., at least, noticed a similar phenomenon: serious illness (in both children and adults) that did not test positive for influenza. They, too, were surprised to find rhinovirus.
"We haven't thought of it as something that causes kids to be really sick and need to be admitted to the ICU," said Kris Bryant, hospital epidemiologist at Kosair Children's Hospital.
Scientists who specialize in rhinovirus are used to their chosen microbe being underestimated, and lauded Children's just for testing for it.
There's an "albatross around their neck," that they are "just the common cold virus," said Ian Mackay, a leading researcher in emerging viruses at the Queensland Paediatric Infectious Diseases Laboratory in Australia.

Intrigued That common cold virus is generally recognized to be responsible for 70 percent or more of colds worldwide, making it the No. 1 cause of respiratory illness.
Mackay was involved with the discovery several years ago of a third group of rhinoviruses, known as human rhinovirus C, that some researchers believe causes more severe illness than the A's and B's. HRV-C presumably has been around for a while, but the molecular tests necessary to find it did not exist until recently.
Mackay also is intrigued by the possibility that the timing of Philadelphia's rhinovirus outbreak - like others, shortly before the flu - was more than coincidence.
A fledgling, highly controversial theory suggests that circulating rhinovirus can somehow delay the spread of influenza - one more reason, Mackay said, to increase the testing and study of rhinovirus.
As a practical matter, finding that rhinovirus is responsible for many illnesses that had been blamed on swine flu may be mainly another motivation to get vaccinated against novel H1N1, researchers said.
Washing your hands and covering your cough is the best way to prevent the spread of both. The only real difference in treatment is that Tamiflu, which reduces the duration of swine flu by one to two days - and is recommended only in severe cases - is useless against rhinovirus.
If the Philadelphia findings are further detailed and found in other cities, however, perhaps they will begin to change perceptions of rhinovirus, said Kathryn Miller, an expert in rhinoviruses and asthma at Monroe Carell Jr. Children's Hospital at Vanderbilt University in Nashville.
They might serve "to make people more aware," she said. "That plain old common cold virus, maybe we need to take it more seriously."

 

[Luvmyzoocrew]

so sorry i tried to edit it so it was more paragraphed and not so big an jumbly,lol

 

[BethM]

fuzz16 wrote:

I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily.
Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

When I got my seasonal flu shot, back in October, the nurse that was giving them told me that seasonal flu was not in Kansas City yet, and that it wouldn't be until January. (They started vaccinating so early 1) get everyone before the virus hit, and 2) because of the holidays, people could travel somewhere that already has it.
She told me that if I did get the flu before then, it was more likely to be H1N1.

 

[BethM]

Fran, that's an interesting article.
I still believe that H1N1 can be dangerous, based on my acquaintance who was otherwise healthy and died from H1N1. I do understand that, for some people, H1N1 can be mild.

I do agree that it's easy for a "popular" sickness to get blamed for other things.
I have a co-worker who thought she had H1N1, but it turned out to be a sinus infection. Another co-worker felt better after getting antibiotics, so that's either big-time placebo effect, or she had something else.
I do think that sometimes people take the cold virus a little too lightly. At the very least, people don't take care of themselves and it can take much longer to recover.


I do have chronic respiratory problems, so I try to be careful with anything that can make it worse.

For me, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin.
The other thing is vomiting. I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting. If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.

 

[fuzz16]

BethM wrote:

fuzz16 wrote:

I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily.
Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

When I got my seasonal flu shot, back in October, the nurse that was giving them told me that seasonal flu was not in Kansas City yet, and that it wouldn't be until January. (They started vaccinating so early 1) get everyone before the virus hit, and 2) because of the holidays, people could travel somewhere that already has it.
She told me that if I did get the flu before then, it was more likely to be H1N1.

NEVER vaccinated in my life, never had the flu...Even though I have MRSA and am easily susceptible to viruses. I may be old fashioned, but I don't beleive in filling my body with all the junk in medicine. I rarely even take pain killers.

 

[Luvmyzoocrew]

BethM wrote:

If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.

lol!!!!

 

[degrassi]

For me, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin. The other thing is vomiting. I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting. If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.

This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".

 

[BethM]

degrassi wrote:

This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".

Well, the CDC says vomiting and diarrhea CAN be symptoms of the flu. I'm inclined to believe the CDC.

 

[BethM]

fuzz16 wrote:

BethM wrote:

fuzz16 wrote:

I wouldn't get it, I have never gotten vaccinatd for any flu type virus and I have a compromised immune system where I get sick easily.
Most of the H1N1 cases have not been true, mainly jus tbad cases of te flu.

When I got my seasonal flu shot, back in October, the nurse that was giving them told me that seasonal flu was not in Kansas City yet, and that it wouldn't be until January. (They started vaccinating so early 1) get everyone before the virus hit, and 2) because of the holidays, people could travel somewhere that already has it.
She told me that if I did get the flu before then, it was more likely to be H1N1.

NEVER vaccinated in my life, never had the flu...Even though I have MRSA and am easily susceptible to viruses. I may be old fashioned, but I don't beleive in filling my body with all the junk in medicine. I rarely even take pain killers.

Well, I wasn't trying to make you go get a vaccine. I was just pointing out the inaccuracy in the statement about what type of flu is prevalent right now.
*sheesh*

I haven't had the flu in many, many years. I only got the vaccine this year because it was free. There's worse chemicals in many processed foods than in vaccines.

 

[degrassi]

BethM wrote:

degrassi wrote:

This is where people are confused. The flu(the influenza virus) doesn't cause vomitting or diarrhea. Most people think of the flu = vomitting and the cold=running nose, cough. But actually the flu(influenza)= cold like symptoms, aches, headache, no vomitting, no D. and vomitting, or diarrhea = stomach virus/bacteria or mild food poisoning. If you have the "stomach flu"(vomitting, achy,D) you most likely picked a mild case of food poisioning or some other intestinal problem, its not "the Flu".

Well, the CDC says vomiting and diarrhea CAN be symptoms of the flu. I'm inclined to believe the CDC.

Well I've been looking over the CDC website and all I can find it this S

stomach symptoms, such as nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, also can occur but are more common in children than adults. Some people who have been infected with the new H1N1 flu virus have reported diarrhea and vomiting.

This doesn't mean that the flu causes vomiting or diarrhea. This means that people have reported having those symptoms while they have the flu. Influenza is a respatory illness. That doesn't mean the odd person won't throw up or have D because they are feeling sick. Why do you think vomiting and diarrhea are listed as side effects for every medication. People experience them for a wide range of reasons.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20030114/flu_not030114/Health?s_name=&no_ads=

 

[BethM]

degrassi wrote:

Well I've been looking over the CDC website and all I can find it this S

stomach symptoms, such as nausea, vomiting, and diarrhea, also can occur but are more common in children than adults. Some people who have been infected with the new H1N1 flu virus have reported diarrhea and vomiting.

This doesn't mean that the flu causes vomiting or diarrhea. This means that people have reported having those symptoms while they have the flu. Influenza is a respatory illness. That doesn't mean the odd person won't throw up or have D because they are feeling sick. Why do you think vomiting and diarrhea are listed as side effects for every medication. People experience them for a wide range of reasons.

http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20030114/flu_not030114/Health?s_name=&no_ads=

I guess I am just really lucky and somehow manage to get food poisoning and the flu at the same time. In the past, when I have had the flu, I vomited. I am quite sensitive, I sometimes vomit when I have a sinus infection, and I sometimes vomit when I have a bad headache, and there are a couple antibiotics that make me vomit. One day last week, I vomited because some jerk wore perfume to work.

If you will go back and read what I wrote: For me, there have always been two major things that differentiate flu from a cold: When I have the flu, my skin hurts. It becomes hyper-sensitive, and anything touching my skin is literally painful. A little bit in an ache-y way, but mostly in a way that's like the sharp end of a needle being dragged over my skin.
The other thing is vomiting. I guess different people have different symptoms, but for me, the flu *always* means vomiting. If I don't vomit, it's not the flu.

I never claimed that you, or anyone else, has to vomit when you have the flu, or that it's not a respiratory ailment.

 

[Orchid]

Hey....RO STAFF & PIPP...

I am wondering as mods....if someone can please put a stop to the constant disagreements that can not seem to end on there own? Lock the thread or something?
This seems to be beyond any point of reason now...and I think is causing some serious negative vibes out there...

For what my two cents are not worth....

 

[irishbunny]

After a two hour wait, we finally got it. It was called Pandemrix or something lol. The wait was so long and boring, lot's of kids running away from their parents and kicking and screaming, I have a head ache from it. Better be worth it! :grumpy:

 

[Pet_Bunny]

irishbunny wrote:

It was called Pandemrix or something lol. Better be worth it! :grumpy:

Ours was called Arepanrix TM, one dose of 0.5 ml in the left arm.

I felt my arm was a littlesore for three days, but then it was fine.

However it doesn't excuse you from washing your hands. :highfive: