WARNING: GRAPHIC PHOTOS INSIDE...... was Surprise litter

[TinysMom]

Well - we have a new litter here. I knew Luna was due today but she's not been nesting - ignoring hay - staying small (sort of) like she was. I was trying to keep an eye on her - but I hadn't moved her to a big mama cage with all the protection stuff because I really was 99.9% sure she didn't take. She was even sweet like usual.

She had a litter tonight - we've found four so far. She had them on the wire - didn't nest - didn't pull fur - didn't really do much of anything. Even now - she's eating and drinking and protecting them now that we've set her up in a cat kennel overnight (so I can get her cage thoroughly cleaned out).

We're gonna go looking to make sure we found all of them - they made it on the floor and squeaked - within 5 seconds Art & Robin were up to find them - and within 2 minutes they'd found all four....

One is sort of peanuty - a bit worried. The others are looking good. Definitely one broken in there....

I'm about to go check for more babies but honestly - I am shocked she had four as she's a smaller doe....and when I tried to palpate her I couldn't feel any.

Peg

 

[BlueGiants]

What a surprise! Glad Art and Robin found them so quickly! Is she nursing them? Is this her first litter? Silly girl not letting you know she was "expecting"!

 

[LadyBug]

sneaky girl! she wanted to suprise you! hope every thng goes well!

 

[Orchid]

Congrats! I hope everything goes well!

 

[maherwoman]

Oh wow! Luna, you stinker...you're supposed to let Mama KNOW that you've got babies!!

Glad you found them in time to warm them up and get things put together for them!

:hug:

 

[TinysMom]

Luna is a horrible mama - this is heartbreaking. Now I remember why I'm getting out of breeding....

She's attacked her babies so we had to take them from her and then take them to her for nursing. While we had her in the box with them a bit ago - she literally grabbed a baby by its leg (it is now gonna lose its leg) and pulled it out from under here- even with us there trying to hold her over them.

One baby has lost one ear and may lose its other ear. The one baby I just mentioned will lose its back leg. Another baby is gonna lose its tail. Then there is the peanut....which is probably just a runt but it is just so darn small.

Although the two litters Mochi is nursing are 15 days old, we decided to see if Mochi would nurse them. I think she's going to try and help us keep them alive. I hate to do this - I don't want to run the risk of her getting mastitis from this...but if she can keep them alive till Wednesday when Girly Girl has her babies...which I'm pretty sure she's gonna have some - then at least one of two of them might have a fighting chance.

I share all this mainly because I know there are folks on this forum or who will come to this forum later on - who will be thinking of breeding. Sometimes the idea to breed is so enticing because you think of the cute baby bunnies. When that happens - I want to direct them to THIS thread...where they can see how heartbreaking it can be too.....

Peg

 

[MsBinky]

I'm sorry to hear that Peg. I was hoping it would be a thrill for you since they are your last breedings I hope they will make it. ray:

 

[TinysMom]

MsBinky wrote:

I'm sorry to hear that Peg. I was hoping it would be a thrill for you since they are your last breedings I hope they will make it. ray:

This is going to sound bad - but please don't take it that way.

First of all - I can't bring myself to cull animals....I know I should (as a breeder)...but I always have to hold out as long as I can and hope that they can make it.

But seeing the condition of some of these babies...I'm almost wishing I could cull...and I'm halfway hoping that a couple of them pass.

What is heartbreaking is that the one she destroyed the leg on....is a broken - my favorites....

This is just hurting so bad right now - I want them to pass - because I have a hard time dealing with disabled rabbits .... and I don't know what their quality of life will be like...but I also want them to make it...

I have one more litter due....I pray all goes well with that one.

Peg

 

[maherwoman]

Oh Peg, that's just awful...I'm so sorry to hear that...:tears2:

 

[undergunfire]

Oh, no . I hope everything turns out okay.

Even bunnies missing legs and ears can live long and happy lives. I am over here hoping they make it. If they do, maybe some forum members will just fall in love with them and want to adopt them .

 

[maisy126]

Awww, I hope they all will do okay

TinysMom wrote:

....and when I tried to palpate her I couldn't feel any.

Me and my mom tried to palp Sadie and we couldn't feel a thing either (she had 5 babies in her)

 

[Maukin]

heartbreaking and definately eye opening for those of us that wish to breed.

Or at least me. That's really all I can speak for.

But this is what happens. Nature is not always nice. And those of us wishing to get into it, need to hear all of these stories so the rose colored glasses can be cracked to say the least.

Life is brutal. I've been in Agricuture for nigh on twenty three years and the only thing I can count on is that I will be seeing something soon that I have never seen before.

Just the way it is.

I hope that everything works out the way it needs too. Which is unfortunately not always the way we want it to.
:sigh:

 

[TinysMom]

Maukin wrote:

I hope that everything works out the way it needs too. Which is unfortunately not always the way we want it to.
:sigh:

The one with the missing ear just passed away in Art's hand a matter of moments ago. I won't go into details except to say that you don't want to hear babies cry....

I probably should have put it down....but we wanted to give it every chance. Even at the end...Art had a qtip w/ warm water and was moistening its lips to see if we could get that in it. I use the qtip and sort of paint the lips to see if I can get them to lick it off...

I suspect the peanut will go next. The one with the leg that got bit still has the leg attached....but it looks horrid. Still yet, it appears to be able to eat. Somewhere I recently saw a video abouta rabbit that had lost a leg to a predator and it showed the rabbit playing. The rabbit still had a pretty decent life. Because of that video - we're going to try to give this one a chance...for now.

Yeah - these are the stories most breeders don't want to hear - they don't want to share. We want to hear everything is wonderful.....but it isn't.

I love Luna - but I'm very upset with the way she treated her babies...which is why Mochi is being used to feed them for now.

There is one in the litter who might be strong enough to make it - if so -I'm hoping to add it to Girly Girl's litter on Wednesday...

I'll be so glad when all my litters are done.....I hate times like this.

Peg

 

[undergunfire]

Can't the baby with the bad leg be brought to the vet or something? What can you do for it?

At this point...is it kind of like a "fish"? When a fish is sick, you can't exactly take it to the vet...and if you do....what can the vet do?

So is this baby like a "sick fish" in a sense? I mean...the vet can't "make him go sleepy" and amputate the leg.


It's confusing . I hope the baby with the bad leg makes it. You haven't talked about him much, but I find myself attached to him because of his story.

 

[TinysMom]

undergunfire wrote:

Can't the baby with the bad leg be brought to the vet or something? What can you do for it?

At this point...is it kind of like a "fish"? When a fish is sick, you can't exactly take it to the vet...and if you do....what can the vet do?

So is this baby like a "sick fish" in a sense? I mean...the vet can't "make him go sleepy" and amputate the leg.


It's confusing . I hope the baby with the bad leg makes it. You haven't talked about him much, but I find myself attached to him because of his story.

Oh Amy...I love your tender heart.

The baby is less than 48 hours old. It has no fur. It weighs probably less than an ounce. The vet probably can't give it painkiller beause a drop would be too much. I highly doubt a vet could sew its leg back on without causing it to bleed to death.

Art & Robin wouldn't let me look at the baby last night after this happened. I got a glimpse of it today but couldn't bring myself to look at it or touch it. The leg is still attached...sorta...by kinda a blood clot. I'd take a photo of it - but it would be too gruesome to show on the forum - even with a warning on it.

Most breeders I know would say, 'Its not gonna make it" and put the baby down immediately. I have thought about it - I have considered it at great length. The last baby who got its leg bitten badly (not quite like this) didn't make it after a couple of days.

The humane thing to do is probably to put it down and not let it suffer. If it was crying or in obvious pain - I would do that (it cried at the time but then it stopped crying to nurse on Mochi). If Mochi was refusing to nurse it - I would consider it because she might know more than I do....but she's willing to let it nurse and it is trying to nurse.

The thing is - I saw a video of a three legged rabbit - and I've heard of others who have them. Those rabbits have a "different" life - but a good life.

I have to give the baby a chance at life.....I just have to. I don't want to - its hard for me to see it....its hard for me to deal with it. I want to throw up when I see it.

But since it does not appear to be in pain and since it appears to be getting some food....I will continue to try and give it a fighting chance.

But my guess is - the odds of survival are about 5%.....maybe less.

Peg

 

[undergunfire]

Is the baby full? I can understand how you don't want to look at it...I would feel the same way at this stage.

I know it's odd chance, but if the baby survives...will the leg eventually fall off or will it have to go to the vet to have it amputated?

 

[NZminilops]

Oh man, how heartbreaking, even if that baby survived, it would have a sever handicap, which I understand is hard for you to deal with.

I hope that whatever needs to happen, happens. I couldn't cull an animal either, way too hard for me, so if that baby needs to pass, I hope that it happens naturally and not too horribly.

I have a soft spot for disabled bunnies, wish I was there to give him a gentle stroke on the head.

 

[maherwoman]

Oh Peg...how horrible...I'm praying for you and the babies...

 

[TinysMom]

undergunfire wrote:

Is the baby full? I can understand how you don't want to look at it...I would feel the same way at this stage.

I know it's odd chance, but if the baby survives...will the leg eventually fall off or will it have to go to the vet to have it amputated?

If the baby makes it to about 4 weeks or so - I will take it to the vet at that point and see what would have to be done. I'm thinking it would have to be amputated and I know the local vet won't do it - I'm not sure if the vet 70 miles away will do it. It might require a trip to the vet in San Antonio. :X

I'm thinking that once the vet sees it at that point - we could make a decision of when to amputate the leg. I would want the baby to be fully weaned and not have intestional issues before it goes under for surgery. I think that to do surgery before the baby is weaned, etc. would only be putting the baby's life further at risk.

The heartbreaking part for me is - we're talking about surgery I really can't afford most likely....although if I have time to save up for it - maybe we could do it....along with the trip to San Antonio (which runs about $70 for gas round trip).

I'm thinking about if the baby makes it a few more days - taking pictures of it and then emailing them to the vet in San Antonio (along with video or something) of the baby and asking for an over the phone consult so that might save me ONE trip - basically so the vet could see things enough to say, "Yes...bring the baby in and let me look at it".

Once again - for those thinking of breeding....these are the freak things that "can" happen. The things that can break your heart - that can make you face decisions you don't want to face....like do I put this baby down or do I not put this baby down?

Also - I want to say that I would not criticize breeders that would put this baby down....because many times that would be the KINDEST thing to do. I don't know if what I'm doing is the best thing for the baby....

The baby isn't getting "full" at its feedings - but it is getting enough to make it to another feeding....so things right now are touch and go.

The runt isn't doing well and I suspect we'll lose it in the next day or so. I thought we were going to lose it earlier today.

Peg

 

[Bo B Bunny]

Oh no

I've been so self absorbed and busy this weekend, I had no idea this was all going on. I'm so sorry, Peg. I know this is so difficult on you and them.