To the rabbit breeders

[ilovetegocalderon]

How many of you are actual rabbit breeders?  And I'm not trying to start a war or anything, just merely want your opinion - what is your defense to those who say that there is an over population of rabbits and breeding doesnt help and whenyou sell your rabbits to others you are taking away a possible whom to one of the MANY rabbits in a shelter?

 

[nose_twitch]

*shudders and hides, praying for peace on earth*

ray:

 

[m.e.]

I'm going torepeat here what I wrote in another thread:

Breeding animals constitute a very small number, and are almostinsignificant within thelarger picture of overpopulation.Breeders are not the ones creating mixed breeds, or abandoning theiranimals at shelters. Many breeders will not even sell their rabbits aspets, for fear that the new owners may try to breed theiranimals.

There are many causes to overpopulation,and breeders are near the bottom of the list. I say this as someone whohas researched and worked in animal rescue, so please don'tmisunderstand me. Breeders are an easy target, but they are not theproblem.

 

[alfie and angel]

Thanks m.e -

I was looking for thread in which you wrote that- it's very well putand made me think differently about the r/ship between breeding andoverpopulation.

I volunteer at arescue centre too and so I would probablyalways prefer to adopt than go to a breeder as a first port of call butit's a personal choice and I think that not only is the point that m.emakes very important but that it should also be noted thatresponsible breeders play a vital part, along with rescue centres inraisingawareness of the dangers and ethical pitfalls ofirresponsible breeding.

More than anything, this forum helps to educate in precisely this vein- I remember a very passionate'Read Before You Breed'Campaign taking place on this forum not so very long ago...

 

[seniorcats]

As someone who has worked in rescue for manyyears, our biggest problem comes from unintentional breeding - peoplewho get a pair of rabbits as petsand the rabbits reproduceand then there are more and more and more and the person who startedwith 2 pets is sitting in a heap of bunnies. Unfortunatelythese inexperienced folks just don't realize how young rabbits canstart reproducing, how it only takes seconds for a mating and theyrarely have the knowledge to sex and seperate. Occassionallywe work with hoarders - genuinely mentally ill people, who hoard a lotmore than animals.

We also have a problem in this areawith carnivals and fairsthat give away live rabbits as prizes because they are cheaper thanother prizes. Many of these rabbits end up surrended to us orend up being let loose in a neighborhood and rounded up by rescue.

Another problem for us in rescue are people who get Easter rabbitsthinking they are cute and cuddly. They have no idea of thecare and no idea of how badly an adolescent bunny can behave.3 months after Easter, they are calling all the rescues.

I think we have only had 1 rabbit come in from a breeder and that wassomeone in 4H who had some family problems. We simply don'tsee pedigreed rabbits in rescue.

Most of the people who adopt from us are interested in a companionanimal and not in showing. I think those folks who go tobreeders for a predigreed animal are probably more interested inshowing. I see the same thing with cat rescue.Those potential adopters are interested in specific breeds and notjust a companion animal.

I do not breed and do not intend to but I also do not think legitmatebreeders need to justify their existence. In my experiencewith rescue in my part of the state, breeders are not a part of theproblem. We also have numerous breeders in this area who takein a limited number of rescues to either foster or to adopt out aspets.

Hope you don't mind me answering even though I am not a breeder.

 

[huntress]

I breed and have no problem telling people thata responsible breeder does not cause the overpopulation problem. Thekey word here being "responsible". I sell very very few pet rabbits. Imainly raise my rabbits for show. But I do supply my excess as meat, Ihave a market that will take all that I can provide.Themajority of the live rabbits I sell are sold as show animals. I also donot sell to pet stores.

The nearest proximity of a shelter is an hour and a half away. I checktheir website frequently and rarely see rabbits up for adoption. On theother hand I have had people driveten hour roundtripto buy a show quality rabbit for a pet.

 

[AnnaS]

I don't think this discussion is leading to anything good.

 

[ilovetegocalderon]

Thanks for all your responses.Contrary to AnnaS' opinion, i found your answers polite and insightfuland helped me better understand the ethics of breeding.

 

[TinysMom]

I've been thinking about your question for a bit now and thought I'd take a moment to answer it.

I live in a small rural area of the country. We have no petstores within 3 hours one way....same with shelters. The onlyplace I know of that you can get rabbits locally - is at the feed store.

So I breed lionheads...for pets and for show. I am working atbuilding a good line of lionheads known for type, mane, and especiallytemperament. (Huntress would probably say they're known fortheir ears too since they're still too big).

Anyway - I think there is a place for breeders...for show rabbits - butalso sometimes we're working on a breed that perhaps not many arebreeding (Palominos for instance I think - not sure). Ormaybe we're developing a new breed (like lionheads or velveteenlops).

I do have a problem with the backyard breeder though who doesn't knowwhat they're doing. I've been studying genetics and workingwith other breeders to create good lionheads that are healthy, etc.

One thing to remember about a breeder is that they can frequently tellyou about the animal you're interested in plus frequently the parentsand maybe even grandparents too!

I do think it is great that folks get rabbits from rescueshelters....I'm not knocking that. I think there is a placefor shelters and a place for breeders.

Peg

 

[ilovetegocalderon]

I definitly can see where you are coming from TinysMom. Thanks for sharing.

 

[rabbitgirl]

TinysMom wrote:

but also sometimes we're working on a breed thatperhaps not many are breeding (Palominos for instance I think - notsure).

You've got that right. Pals are extremely rare! We need more responsible breeders for this breed.

Rose

 

[Erins Rabbits]

I've been thinking about a good defense to this since I was booted off of 'Bunspace'. The answer, for me, is that, If I've been paying close enough attention,HRS people, rescuers,etc, are always keen on rescuingmeat rabbits. Seriously. You really think you'll be able to find homes for 200 big, white, meat rabbits? But that's okay. Cause they won't ever be on someones plate. Don't get me wrong- the thought of eating a rabbit kills me (vegetarian) but we have to be aware of the fact that maybe there wouldn't be so many euthanised, put in shelters, abandoned if we weren't so opposed to even the most humane methods of slaughter.

:sofa:

I am one of several breeders who only sells/gives bunnies to people who know what they're getting into, have raised rabbits in the past, or present. I had an, ah, interesting ordeal with a potential pet owner that changed my whole outlook. He lied to me about the two little does he was taking. They were to be suposed pets. About an hour later his daughter came up and told us they were under their kitchen sink, waiting for slaughter. This killed me, so I went down, gave the man his money back, and took them home. They are now both living with a little girl who is using them for 4-h. I won't sell to pet stores, feed stores, or anyone irresponsible.

JMPO.

 

[irishbunny]

This is a good question, your very brave
I always thought breeders in the USA must have a part to play in the problem, they have ARBA and 4-H and all that and rabbitrys often breed a very large amount of rabbits. Whereas here in Ireland, no one keeps large rabbitrys, breeders only keep a few rabbits and breed every so often, we have nothing like ARBA and have no rabbit shows, but we have no rabbit overpopulation and a rabbit only ever comes into a shelter once every month or two.

This was just my own theory though and I can see now it's probably not the case.

 

[clevername]

ilovetegocalderon wrote:

How many of you are actual rabbitbreeders? And I'm not trying to start a war or anything, justmerely want your opinion - what is your defense to those who say thatthere is an overpopulation of rabbits and breeding doesnt help and whenyou sell your rabbits to others you are taking away a possible whom toone of the MANY rabbits in a shelter?

I'm a rabbit breeder. I currently keep 4 different breeds, 3 of which are considered rare.

I breed to practical purposes. My angora are for wool; Silver Fox and Americans are for conservation. I sell to people who approach me for pets, livestock and/or show and I meet my buyers face to face before exchanging rabbits. I even have a policy in which I will take back any animal I've sold if the owner can no longer care for them.

"what is your defense to those who say thatthere is an overpopulation of rabbits?"
Personally, most of my rabbits are endangered. Overpopulation doesn't apply to them.

I DO see a whole lot of mix breeds in shelters though, which seems to imply that these rabbits aren't coming from show breeders but from the general pet population. You can't force people not to breed their pets anymore than you can force them to take good care of them. So I really don't agree with the guff people give towards breeders if its the pet owners who contribute to most of the problem.

"whenyou sell your rabbits to others you are taking away a possible whom toone of the MANY rabbits in a shelter?"
I don't think my rabbits take homes away from shelter rabbits because most adoptable rabbits wouldn't be a suitable replacement. I get people coming to me who want a specific type/breed of rabbit and its a little hard to find that at a shelter.

I also don't really understand how shelters can be overstocked with rabbits...I have 37 right now and I'm doing just fine. On average is takes about $14 a year to feed a rabbit and only a minimal amount of upkeep to maintain their health (with the exception of angora breeds).

I'm all for placing these guys in good homes, but I don't think my small rabbitry has any impact on the wellfare of the rabbits currently in shelters.

Just my perspective. No offense intended.

 

[NorthernAutumn]

Wow, post from the past Remember, this was first brought up in 2006; won't the original posters be surprised to see it again?

 

[irishlops]

irishbunny wrote:

This is a good question, your very brave
I always thought breeders in the USA must have a part to play in the problem, they have ARBA and 4-H and all that and rabbitrys often breed a very large amount of rabbits. Whereas here in Ireland, no one keeps large rabbitrys, breeders only keep a few rabbits and breed every so often, we have nothing like ARBA and have no rabbit shows, but we have no rabbit overpopulation and a rabbit only ever comes into a shelter once every month or two.

This was just my own theory though and I can see now it's probably not the case.

ok im not a breeder.) so... yes, in shelter near me. only dogs an cats are in there...
it has places for rabbits aswell but only 5 were there. then they were bought, and the spaces were empty for 3months!!!
i think breeding in small no. helps rare breeds. i am just really repeting what others have said...

 

[Jenson]

ilovetegocalderon wrote:

How many of you are actual rabbitbreeders? And I'm not trying to start a war or anything, justmerely want your opinion - what is your defense to those who say thatthere is an overpopulation of rabbits and breeding doesnt help and whenyou sell your rabbits to others you are taking away a possible whom toone of the MANY rabbits in a shelter?

I breed Standard Rex on a small scale.

I don't have a problem with breeding pedigree rabbits if the right motivation is there. I breed Rex because I love the breed. Standard Rex numbers have been dropping for a long time in the UK, as is happening with many breeds. I don't feel guilty at all for breeding because I know that this breed in particular desperately need more dedicated people to help keep them going or they will die out. We have already seen some colours disappear.

I also agree entirely with clevername, you don't see a lot of pedigree rabbits needing homes (in the UK at least), which suggests the problem is not with dedicated breeders, but people who breed carelessly for fun/profit/whatever and don't spay/neuter their pets.

I breed for type, health and temperament. I try to breed to the breed standard and I breed for what I think makes a good Standard Rex.

I also donate to rabbit rehome, rescues and the PDSA etc. whenever I can, as well as having rescued a good number of rabbits myself. I am concerned about the over population which is why I discourage careless or needless breeding, but you also have to understand that good, responsible breeding is vital for the welfare of rabbits and the survival of our different breeds.

 

[naturestee]

Holy old thread!

As a rescue person and shelter volunteer, I'm A-OK with show breeders, people breeding for good type, realistic expectations and plans for the babies, etc. I do wish more 4H kids here were better instructed, and when we do get a tattooed rabbit it usually came from a 4H kid. Either they got tired of caring for it (fairly common) or didn't plan well for the babies they bred. Very few if any of our rabbits were bred by show breeders.

Now, backyard/irresponsible breeders- I could strangle some of them. Anyone who knows my experience with fostering babies for the shelter and how a whole big group of rabbits ended up having syphilis from their owner's stupidity (not to mention every female came in pregnant and had to be spayed ASAP, my mama bun was missed so she had her litter and we're still trying to find homes for them 7months later)... yeah I'd probably hurt that person if I were ever to meet her. Same with the person who dumped his baby factories on us the day after Easter. These are the people I have issues with.

 

[polly]

I think the main problem breeders have is that we all get lumped together by a lot of pet people they don't understand show breeding for type conservation because they are so upset about how many rabbits are unwanted or in shelters. Unfortunately though good breeders know as much and understand the problems better as they can see both sides but never get seen to be like this becuase people dont see past "breeder!!"

I breed netherland dwarfs reason : a lot of people decided to give up certain nethie colours when mini lops first came on the scene. Yes nethies are a well represented breed though I would say misunderstood sometimes temprement wise but they are a breed true to my heart as they are what i had as pets before beginning breeding and it was my love of the breed when i was having problems getting a new one that too me into breeding and showing them.


Lionheads: well actually I am going to be stopping breeding these mainly because I dont feel teh standard adhered to and there are plenty of people taking the challenge up to get them to a creditable similar standard


Bleu beverens: I am taking these on in place of the lionheads which is another reason I have given LH's up. Beverens are a very old breed and were one of the first breeder clubs in the Uk that also went on to work with the main clubs of the time and start the BRC they are now almost a rare breed with smaller rabbits becoming more popular. Would I sell them as pets well to be honest there are so few around you would be very lucky to get one as a pet possibly I would but boy would you have to prove yourself to me first!!

 

[naturestee]

Polly, you're very right that many rescue people lump all breeders together. It's pretty rotten. I wish I could drag some of these people to shows so they can see responsible breeders. I've only had time to go to one so far as I usually have to drive a fair bit, but it was a great experience and everyone was so nice. More of us have seen the 4H shows at county fairs, and those can be hit or miss as far as the standard of care and knowledge of the kids. It really depends on the adults running the program. Unfortunately in my area they don't seem very good and they care more about making the child feel good than quality rabbit care and breeding. It's not unusual to see larger buns with bad urine burns and bleeding sore hocks getting blue ribbons.