The ups and downs of bonding

[Emmits_mom]

Well, we've had Amelia since Saturday, and atfirst, things seemed to be going pretty well for she andEmmit. They are in the same room, but are separated betweentwo pens (6 inches apart) so they cannot bite each other or anything,but they can sniff and see each other. Right away Emmit wasreally interested in her. He hasn't been around otheranimals, but she has. She was more concerned with her newroom and new cage.

So finally in the last few days she's started to notice him.He used to just sit there and watch her hop around and stuff, and shedidn't even see that there was another rabbit in the room.Much to his delight, she was finally interested in him as well so westarted swappingblankets andpoopies and stuff sothey could get each other's scent.

They started doing binkiesaround each other, and a few timesthey would laynext to thepens (as close as theycould get).

But the other day when Islipped out of the roomfor2 minutes to get their romaine, I came back up andtheyhad found a spot in the penswhere the two penswere very close. Theyseemed to be trying to scratchat each other.I checked both of them out, and neither one hadgotten hurt, nor did they seem to have any marks on them, so I don'tknow if they actually reached each other or not. Ever sincethat incident all they want to do is get over to the otherside. She continues to try to claw at the pen on her side,and he sometimes does the same. I have no idea what this allmeans. Maybe she wants to go over there to mount him (becausewe think that she'll be the dominate one). And I think thathe gets jealous when I sit with her on her side to pet her.He just sits and stares at us.

I switched them today-so she got to investigate his cage and side ofthe room, and he got to check out her pad. They seemed inmuch better moods when they got to do that, so I think ithelped.

Does anyone have experience with bonding bunnies and could you give mesome tips? I'm being patient with them, but I just don't knowwhat the whole digging/stratching at each other means. I needsome help! Thanks everyone.

-a worried bun mommy- Carrie

 

[Sarah]

The fact that they were laying side by sideagainst the pens is a good sign. The parallel lying is something bondedrabbits do. They might be scratching because they want to be together.It might be time to let them spend some time together. Neutralterritory is the safest place. The backseat of your car or a bathtub.

When we bonded Pauly and Mella we put them in the bathtub (with nowater of course) It's an area neither have ever been and it's closeenough that they're forced to take notice of each other. They sniffedeachother for a moment, and then Pauly mounted Mella's side. Yes, hisinstincts as to where to mount are a bit off, but she submitted. It'snot easy to watch the dominance dance take place. Pauly was with usfirst, so we had a very strong bond with him, as I know you do withEmmit. I was really worried about how I'd feel if I saw Pauly getdominated. It turned out to be unsettling even though it was Mella whowas put in her place. It's not the best part of the bonding process forsure.

After the tub we put their cages next to eachother and let them playtogether and go into their cages whenever they wanted, so they hadoptions. It wasn't long before Mella was nibbling out of Pauly's foodbowl and Paul was letting it happen. It took a few weeks for them tocuddle and groom eachother, but now it's a constant love-fest. Theylive together in the same cage, and surely wouldn't have it any otherway. At this pointtheir doesn't seem to be anydominancestuff. Pauly is sort oftop rabbit in thathe lords over the food bowls, but he is usually the one grooming Mella,while she just lies aroundenjoying it. Iguess oncethey're bonded there's a sort of equality in the way they treateachother.

The most important thing when they are face to face is to keep an eyeon them to make sure no one gets hurt, though it soundsasifthey like eachother already. Emmit was cool smelling her& seeing her in his house, so maybe he's just waiting tobe cut loose.

Mine were only around 7 months and 4 months when they were bonded, so Idon't know if that had some bearing on their quick friendship. I'veheard that it's not unusual for rabbits to have a "love at first sight"sort of bond, so maybe that's what Amelia (love her name by the way)and Emmit are feeling.

 

[Emmits_mom]

Thanks so much for the reply. Emmit is7 months, and we think that Amelia is around 10 months old. Ithink that this weekend, as long as things continue to go well (nogrunts or biting or other bad signs), then I'll take away one of thepens so that only one pen is in between them..I haven't done theneutral territory thing yet because Martin has been on a business tripall week and I want the both of us there incase we have to breakanything up. I hope that they are getting along and that thescratching just means that they want to see each other. Theystopped stratching when I let them explore each other'sareas. Emmit made himself at home in her cage, and she didthe same in his.

Thanks very much Sarah, you were very helpful. I'm still up for more suggestions!

-Carrie

 

[Rowan]

The website that Buck often mentions and I oftengo to just to look at in awe of how many bunniesyou can gettolive happily together iswww.mybunnies.com/bonding.htmWhen my little sweeties are all safely neutered I'm going to sit themin front of the computer screen to look at those photos and LEARN .She does have a lot of good advice as well as the photos. Hope it allgoes well with you and that before long we'll be seeing pictures ofAmelia and Emmit as the happy couple .

 

[Buck Jones]

Sarahwrote:

...It might be time to let them spend some time together.Neutral territory is the safest place. The backseat of your car or abathtub.






Sarah is on the money as far as I am concerned. We have hadsome success by placing the buns on the kitchen table after covering itwith a blanket. Table height enables us to monitor behaviorquickly and comfortably, without breaking our backs like we do when weplace them in the bathtub. Tub's advantage, a small one in myestimation, is the lack of any distractions because they can only seeoneanother.

My wife helps the process by cooing to the buns in high pitchedbaby-talk manner, which they find soothing. We also offertreats in an effort to have them eat along side one another.We start out with minimal time on the table and work up to hoursessions. Once we see mutual grooming, we know the process isalmost complete.

We have had instant bonding on one occasion, but most couples take oneto three weeks of work. Acid test is spending time in thecage together. Right now, our Missy and Calbert are doingfine together when they are loose or in the outdoor hutch.Placed in their indoor cage, Missy is unable to evade Calbert's amorousintentions, so some squabbling results. They are not ready tobe left alone in one cage without supervision, yet.

The site Rowan mentioned is one of the better sites I've been able tofind. House Rabbit Society also provides good suggestions.

Good luck and the best of success. A bonded couple is a joy to behold.

Buck

 

[LuvaBun]

Hi Carrie, As well as the excellent site Rowan mentioned, you could also try this one

http://www.rabbit.org/journal/4-4/tough-bonding.html

I was really lucky with perry and Pernod. I got them from the rescuecentre the same day, and although they hadn't been together and weren'tbonded, they fell 'in Love' the first night. We had arranged twoseparate areas for them but when it came to put them in them for thenight, they wouldn't be kept apart. I had a sleepless night thinkingevery sound was them trying to kill each other, but every time Ichecked on them they were snuggled up together, wondering who this darnnosey human was who kept interupting their sleep! They have been verylovey dovey ever since, although Pernod does dometimes mount him toshow she's in charge. I've also heard that driving with them togetheron the back seat of a car works well. Best of luck.

Jan

 

[Emmits_mom]

Okay, new update: Emmit and Amelia's first "date"

Tonight martin and I took the two of them out for a car ride.They each had their own carrier, but we had them facing eachother. Then we brought them inside into the basement (wherethey have never been) to a pen we set up. We opened theircarriers and let them explore.

I couldn't watch most of it because I was SO nervous, so martin stayedinside with them to break anything up. Emmit was the first tocome out of his carrier, and eventually she did too. Theyignored each other for a while, but then Emmit attemped to mounther...but he did it backwards and she didn't really like that toomuch. Martin broke them up and put them on opposite sides ofthe pen.

They ignored each other some more for a few minutes. ThenAmelia approached him and they got into a little tussle...no teeth orclaws, but more like wressling. Martin let them do it forabout 15 seconds, then broke it up, and again put them on oppositesides.

The same thing happened as before: they ignored each other, Ameliaapproached. This time itlooked like she was tryingto playfully nip him, and he didn't like it so the wressling/tusslestarted. They had been in there for about 10 min total so wecalled it a night after that last little tussle. During theirdown-time in the pen they each flopped on opposite sides of the pen, ineyes view.

Now they are in their separate cages-wiped out.

Is this a good date? there was no blood shead...just a littlefur shead. We won't be able to do anything more until sundaybecause we're going to a quick family reunion until then. Butthen we'll probably do the same thing but change theenvironment. Let me know guys! I know I can trustthe info you all give me.

-Carrie

 

[Emmits_mom]

sorry this is so long!

 

[Rowan]

I haven't tried doing it personally yet but fromwhat I've read sounds good to me . The bonding website says it cantake up to three weeks of them doing that every day before they bondhappily, and since there was no blood or anything it sounds verypromising .

Keep us updated, since I'll be doing it myself before too long I'm extra interested in how it goes.

 

[Sarah]

Sounds pretty good. Too bad about the tussles.The mounting is a good thing unless they start biting and fussing. Iguess Amelia isn't ready for that yet, but if Emmit initiated it, he'sprobably interested in her.

A cheating kind of trickis while the two of them are in thesmall pen, minding their own business pet both of them. The associationof the gentle loving pets while being near the other rabbit can help.They will feel calm andhappy from your lovin' and may startto associate it with the other rabbit. I think I read about it in theHouse Rabbit Handbook or maybe on the HRS website.

 

[Emmits_mom]

We tried again today, this time in thekitchen. It didn't last long because Emmit was so aggressivetoday for some reason. Amelia was perfectly happy and wantedto snuggle, but he kept attacking. Poor Amelia. Ithink that it was the tile flooring...he hated it because it wasslippery. We're trying again tonight back downstairs and thistime I am going to have to watch to help calm Emmit down...cause healways does when his mommy pets him...hopefully it will go better.

-Carrie

 

[Buck Jones]

As I said, kitchen table height enables one tobreak up any fisticuffs quickly. Your voice, in high pitch,cooing, baby talk, should help to settle them and not focus on fightingeach other.

Your "dates" don't sound all that bad. Obviously, it is notgoing to be love at first sight, but if there's been no blood shed, itjust seems you are going to have to work at it.Eating together(treat) is another trick because they will bedoing something together, at close quarters, without getting on oneanother's nerves. Gives 'em a chance to realize the otherbun's not so bad, after all.

Our first dates ar usually no more than 5 -15minutes. We gradually increase time until somethinguntoward occurs, that suggest we shut it down until nexttime. By the time we work up to an hour, we expect to beginto see some mutual grooming. Once that occurs, you'rerelatively assured that the bonding will be successful eventually, ifnot immediately thereafter.

Cage time together in increasing increments undersupervision. All day in cage together with no fighting, meansa night together might be possible, just make sure you have accesseasily during the night, should something go amiss.

All night together, for us, has meant successful bonding hasoccurred. We still working with Missy/Calbert because heinsists on becoming amorous within the cage. No problemloose, nor in the outside hutch, which is larger than thecage.So, he's not ready yet.

Our other bonded couple, Mickie and Maizie, who have been togetherquite a while will often have squabbles when in the presence of otherrabbits, especially a buck. Mickie will tend to take hisaggression out on Maizie. Mazie just runs until she's hadenough and then will "bark" back at him. Shocked, he usuallywill quit being a prig.

Don't get discouraged. It would seem things are going okay for now.

Buck

 

[Emmits_mom]

Okiedokie...new update. Their attitudestoward each other seem to change every day. We finally havethem semi-comfortable around each other-enough so that when they areboth being pet, they can lay next to each other.

A break through tonight: Emmit was calm and while he wasbeing throughly pet, Amelia voluntarily laid down next tohim. They can be next to each other as long as we are pettingthem, but the second we stop, Emmit tries to be dominant bun, andmounts her...she doesn't take his booty crap, so she fights back, andso does he and so on.

Another problem is that she is SO jumpy. We're so used to acalm and easy-going Emmit. Amelia is very jumpy.Emmit will go up to her to smell her, and she'll jump so high, or he'llscare her just by coming closer, so she'll attack.

They both seem to want to be the dominant bunny which really doesn'thelp this at all. And neither one backs down.Amelia even attacks Martin if it goes onfor toolong. He wears thick gloves and long-sleeved shirts now onthe bunny dates just in case.

I don't know what is going to happen yet. She's so jumpy,even around us. When she finally calms down and settles,she's very sweet and will love to be pet all night and can be veryaffectionate. But she gets frightened too easily. Ithink she is having problems trusting us.

Also, we can practically read Emmit's mind, and he trusts us fully, sohe's easy to understand...Amelia's psyche is totally unknown territoryfor all of us...

We love her so much. If things never work out with Emmit, shemight just come and live permanently with me as a single bun, and we'lltry to find a laid-back, submissive girl bun for Emmit tolove. He needs some bunny lovin' we can tell...More tocome. Here are 2 pictures I took of the two of them watchingeach other between two pens during exercise time.



You can just see him studying her on the other side as she lays nextto the pen...he sometimes would lay on the otherside next to her.

 

[Emmits_mom]

Here they are. Emmit inhales hisvegies very quickly, but she takes her time, so he is watching her inenvy eat the rest of her lettuce.

 

[Sarah]

They'resuch a good looking couple! Someone is just going to have to give it upand be humped!

sorry...Ijust want them to bond.Amelia is such a complicated woman.

I've only bonded one pair. Maybe BuckJones will have anothersuggestion. Perhaps some Marvin Gaye music and a platterofromaine and carrots would set the mood? Too bad bunniesdon't drink...

 

[Emmits_mom]

Hahahaha! That's so funny,Sarah. I wish that she would just give in too...she's far toohyper and independent for that I suppose. They had anotherscuffle last night as well...hair was flying. Emmit hadleaped the 3-foot barrier to get to her side of the room to get to herwhen Martin wasn't looking...

They're so weird! They seem so in-love when they areapart. When they have a pen or if they are in their cages,they show off to each other. Emmit does binkies, Amelia licksher cage. They seem so into each other until we allow them tomeet---then hell breaks loose!

I talked to an ARBA judge yesterday at our local fair (Grange Fairwooo!) and he said that Florida Whites (Amelia) are a very agressiveand skitterish breed...he basically said we have our work cut out forus.

Anyway, I miss them terribly because I've been at the fair with myGrandma, so I'm going over to see them soon. I even got up at7 to watch the rabbit show at 8 just to get a rabbit fix...

oh and they have the MOST adorable baby mini-lops for sale...I want one! I'm still working on Martin though...

-Carrie

 

[Emmits_mom]

Hi again everyone. Just to update:

Today was the first time in a week that we have put them togetheragain. First we tried putting them on the dryer in abox. That worked for a little while. Amelia wasreally scared, and she tucked her little head uner his body forcomfort. But that startled him, so he didn't really enjoy ittoo much. He was patient with her for a little while, butthen when they got their heads close to each other he tried to lunge ather. Martin intervened just in time, so she never got hurt,nor did she get mad at Emmit...so that's good.

So then we decided to take them for a bumby car ride. Likealways we put them in their separate carriers...this car ride was justto stress them out a bit. Then again we put them in neutralterritory.

This part lasted for nearly an hour. Most of the time theyjust ignored each other. They kind of claimed their sectionof the pen and stayed there. Once and a while Martin gotEmmit in such a deep "petting trance" so Amelia was able to come overand smell him without Emmit trying to bite her.

The first time she acted like she does with us when she wants us to pether: She puts her head down close to Emmit's face.We think she wanted him to groom her or pay attention to her.

The next time she came over when he was in his little petting trance,she came over smelled him around his mid-section, then tried to nip athim. We're not too sure what that meant.

The other few times they came into real contact was when Emmit came tosee her. He always tries to go after her, and when he does,it makes her mad so she fights back. Luckily though for ustonight, Martin was able to stop Emmit every time before he actuallybit her, so she never got mad. We stopped at what we thoughtwas a good point. This was when Emmit was being pet, and shesniffed his face, and he "let her". He still was a little"tranced" from being pet, but at least he knew she was there.

We don't know if this is a good night or not. He still wantedto bite her when she came near or when he came near her. Shegot frustrated when he wouldn't groom her. I still think theyboth want to be dominant buns.

-Carrie

PS: When I say "trancing" I mean being so relaxed from beingpet. Emmit gets SUPER relaxed when pet, and even after westop, he'll sit there for at least a minute or two.