my poor baby has pasteurella.. and i need some help!!!!!!!

[enslaved]

In early december lapin (french for rabbit) had a surgery to remove a abcess on her back caused by pasteurella. She recovered great. But she had to go to the vet earlier this month because she had a few bumps which needed to get squeezed out and she was put on more antibiotics.

I really want to get her fixed. One vet tells me it's ok to get her fixed, but another vet tells me it's not ok because the pasteurella will infect the wound. One vet tells me to put her on long term antibiotics, the other vet tells me thats not a good idea. I just don't know what to do!!!

My vet told me thats it's ok to put antibiotics in yogurt, because she gets soo mad at me everytime I give her antibiotics. I was wondering if this is ok, and how much is good for her. She has to take her antibiotics twice a day, and I'm so scard I'm going to hurt her little mouth with the syringe! I have been giving her fat free yogurt that only has a little bit of sugar. She really likes it.

Any advice would be great! I just don't know who to trust! Thanks!!!

 

[sandhills_rabbits]

I am so sorry that little Lapin has Pasteurella.It sounds like a very trying situation... trying to get her well andfixed up. I hope that you are able to get her to take the antibioticsokay, and that she makes a full recovery.....

Now, the question I have is what is Pastuerella exactly, what causesit, how does it effect rabbits, and how common is it? Sorry for all thequestions..... If anyone can shed some light on the topic it would begreat!

 

[Buck Jones]

For a considerable amount of information uponpasturella link tohttp://homepage.mac.com/mattocks/morfz/rabrefs.htmlandscroll down to Pasturella, where you will find several othersites to link to, some very graphic, so be advised.

It is a tough thing to diagnose properly and treat successfully, as you are finding out, enslaved.

Buck

 

[sandhills_rabbits]

Thanks so much, Buck, for the link to someinformation! I'll read up on it so that way I'm more knowledgable aboutthe things that can plague and devastate our bunnies. Also thanks forthe warning on the graphic sites..... I dont have a squeemish bone inmy body, so I'm sure I'll be okay, but thanks for the heads up anyways!

 

[enslaved]

Thanks for the sites. I've done tons of researchalready. But I coulden't find anything about getting her fixed or aboutthe long term antibiotics. Well I have seen a few things on the longterm antibiotics, but as I said before one thing will says its a goodidea and another will says its a bad idea. I do like the vet I go too.Its just it is hard to find a good rabbit vet. Alot of them will lieand say they know about rabbits just to get your money. I just reallydon't know who to trust right now. All I want is to give my lapin agood life and keep her happy untill the pasteurella finally kills her.

 

[Carolyn]

Greetings enslaved,

Total elimination of the Pasteurella, especially the rhinitis,infection is difficult, if not impossible. The bacteria lies asequestered pus in the labyrinthine nasal passages and are isolatedfrom antibiotics. Antibiotics can suppress the nasal discharge, but thebacteria will usually remain and repopulate when the antibiotictreatment is stopped.

Be careful of the vet who diagnoses Pasteurella without doing aculture/sensitivity test. With this test, the vet can determine whatpathogen is causing the infection and provide the antibiotics needed.Different strains (i.e., Bordatela brochiseptica, Streptococcus, etc.)would call for different antibiotics, but they're often misdiagnosed asPasteurella because the symptoms parallel.

I'll be thinking and praying for you and your little one.

-Carolyn

 

[enslaved]

No one ever told me abou this culture/sensitivitytest you speak of. Thanks!! I defently am going to give my vet acall!!! But can anyone tell me if she can be spayed???

 

[Carolyn]

That's odd that they didn't do the culture before they diagnosed her.Did they do a deep nasal, ear or eye culture or a urinalysis on her?I'd definitely get the culture/sensitivity test done, if you're able toafford it. I was informed that that should be done before anyantibiotics are given so that you're using the proper one to attack thepathogen causing the infection.

As Kathy Smith said in her book, "Pseudomonas aeruginosa, Bordatellabrochiseptica, Steptococcus, and Staphylococcus infections arefrequently mistaken for Pasturella because the symptoms are verysimilar."

Sometimes a bacteria won't respond to all antibiotics, so that's whyyou really want to get it right as to what bacteria you're dealingwith.

In some cases, antibiotics can upset some rabbit's GI system. Keepaware of any changes in Lapin's appetite and stools while on theantibiotics and if you see a shift, you should discuss it immediatelywith your vet.

Some vets like to do a follow-up in two weeks after the start of theantibiotic to see if it's having an impact on the infection.

As to getting her spayed, I'd try to get on the other side of thesniffles first. A doctor would have to know how the anesthesia wouldact when coupled with the antibiotic.

-Carolyn

 

[pamnock]

It's really going to be a judgment call on your part. You'll have to weigh the benefits and the risks . . .

The surgery would prevent a Pasteurella infection of the reproductiveorgans and would also eliminate the chances of uterine tumors oruterine cancer.

The risks are the fact that the rabbit already has a compromised immunesystem and will be more prone to infection and stress from thesurgery. The younger she is, the better she'll be able totolerate the surgery (I can't recall if you mentioned herage). Her present condition is also a factor.

There is a possibility that surgery will cause the Pasteurella infection to spread if it has already invaded other tissues.

There are some antibiotics that are appropriate for long term use in rabbits.

Pam

 

[Carolyn]

Antibiotics quote from Kathy Smith, author of the book Rabbit Health in the 21st Century - 2nd Edition

"For severe and persistent infections, the same antibiotic may beprescribed in both systematic and topical forms. Alternatively, twosystemic antibiotics from two different drug classes may be prescribedconcurrently, giving a synergistic effect. Usually this consists of adrug that can be safely used long term (for example, a flouroquinolonesuch as Baytril, Ciprofloxacin, or Dicural) and one that should only beused short-term (for example, an aminoglycoside or injectiblepenicillin)."

 

[enslaved]

They did not do any tests before she wasdiagnosed. They just said that she defently had pasteurella, and neededsurgery. Before I know it shes in surgery, comes out, and I was givenantibiotics as well as a pain killer. Which I find odd that they didnot test her since Caroylnhave given me this information,because this is a recomended rabbit vet.

 

[Carolyn]

You can only go from here, enslaved.

We completely support you and are praying for the best for Lapin.

God knows you love her, dearly.

How is she doing now?

How's her breathing, etc.?

-Carolyn

 

[enslaved]

Thanks soo much for the help. She eats great,everything is great. Her poop is fine even with the antibiotics. Sheacts like she is not even sick. I just can't get rid of this horriblebump!

 

[Gabby]

enslaved wrote:

In early december lapin (french for rabbit) had a surgery toremove a abcess on her back caused by pasteurella. She recovered great.But she had to go to the vet earlier this month because she had a fewbumps which needed to get squeezed out and she was put on moreantibiotics. I really want to get her fixed. One vet tells me its ok toget her fixed, but another vet tells me its not ok because thepasteurella will infect the wound. One vet tells me to put her on longterm antibiotics, the other vet tells me thats not a good idea. I justdon't know what to do!!! My vet told me thats its ok to put antibioticsin yogurt, because she gets soo mad at me everytime I give herantibiotics. I was wondering if this is ok, and how much is good forher. She has to take her antibiotics twice a day, and I'm so scard I'mgoing to hurt her little mouth with the syringe! I have been giving herfat free yogurt that only has a little bit of surgar. She really likesit. Any advice would be great! I just don't know who to trust!Thanks!!!

It's in forms of abcesses on her back correct? did itreoccure? or does she had additional ones? I have found thebest treatmentin my experience for abcesses of any kind on arabbit, is to treat them openly. That would be everything removed , butthe wound left opened and treated with antibiotics as well as topicaltreatment. This in my experience has the lowest rate of regrowth, andhighest rate of successful cure.

As for antibiotics, Alot of them need to be on antibiotics for anadditional 30 days AFTER it appears to be healed up. some do tag teamwith 2 drugs, one long term one short term, but this also works wellwith the long term being a pill, and the short term being topical aswell.

As for things you can hide her pills in, smal amts of banana are goodif she likes it, banana generally hides the taste of the pills thebest. but you can try other foods such as small peices of fruit, and orcrush it mix it in with a very small amt of apple sauce or other suchitem. Baby food works well for this, you can choose a fruit, or veggie,just remember 1 small jar should last you 3 days, 2 doses aday. I hear some have success hiding pills in crasins aswell.

As far as her spay, how old is she? If she is young you have time towait. And if you can get what she has now under control first, ipersonally think that would be the best route. I feel that ifshe is in that high of a danger of it being spread to her reproductivesystem already then you may be fighting a loosing battle. But iftreating her lumps and bumps can be brought under control, then by allmeans spay the dear.

i hope some that helps.

 

[enslaved]

Thanks alot for the info Gabby. Do you reallythink it could spread to her respritory system!!?! Thats horrible. Shesbreating just fine, she even runs around and gets all excited andbreaths just fine. Yes it was a abcess on her back. It was surgicallyremoved. She healed up great. But as the hair was growing back twospots had no hair. I got worried and took her to the vet, and theyopened the spots and squeezed them out, and put her on moreantibiotics. They do not want to put her on long term antibiotics. Iquestioned them about this and they just seemed to think it was ahorrible idea and was not necessary. She is estimated about 2. Iobtained her from a person who bought her and did not realise how muchwork a rabbit was just before the summer. I was going to get herspayed, but than this horrible abcess. At first it was misdiagnosed asjust a sist. I was told not to worry. But I started to when it did notgo away. And here I am now, I have fallen in love with a sick rabbit.

 

[Gabby]

enslaved wrote:

Thanks alot for the info Gabby. Do you really think it couldspread to her respritory system!!?! Thats horrible. Shes breating justfine, she even runs around and gets all excited and breaths just fine.Yes it was a abcess on her back. It was surgically removed. She healedup great. But as the hair was growing back two spots had no hair. I gotworried and took her to the vet, and they opened the spots and squeezedthem out, and put her on more antibiotics. They do not want to put heron long term antibiotics. I questioned them about this and they justseemed to think it was a horrible idea and was not necessary. She isestimated about 2. I obtained her from a person who bought her and didnot realise how much work a rabbit was just before the summer. I wasgoing to get her spayed, but than this horrible abcess. At first it wasmisdiagnosed as just a sist. I was told not to worry. But I started towhen it did not go away. And here I am now, I have fallen in love witha sick rabbit.

if it is pasturella it very well can spread to the lungs. That is onereason why it'd so important to get a culture and sensitivity test tobe sure you are dealing with it and not some other type of bacteria, orvirus. Quite often pasturella infects many of the internalorgans of the body, and you would think the vet would want to be sure.Far to often vet are quick to jump on, if a bun has any illness "itmust be pasturella," they never think to check and be sure.. We need tostart training our vet to look further into our buns illnesses and notjust judge them at face value. Different infections respond todifferent drugs, so the more info and facts we have on the culpritcausing the problem, the better equip we can be to handle it.

Please keep us informed on how she is, and what kind of service you aregetting from your vet. best wishes, will keep our pawscrossed for the 2 of you.

 

[enslaved]

Thanks alot for all the wishs and prayers for men moi lapin. Shes doing great. Thanks too all the information everyonehas provided me I'm going to try a different vet and see what they cando for me!

 

[bluebird]

They cannot tell if it pastueurella just bylooking at the rabbit.other diseases have the same symptoms and arabbit with pasteurella would need to be on antibiotics forever.aculture needs to be done.bluebird

 

[Carolyn]

Bump for Dr. Kraz.

-Carolyn