Loss of a litter... very sad

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BlueGiants

BlueGiants

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Almost everyone knows that I breed my rabbits... as I've said many times, with a great deal of forethought and preparation, and always with the best interests of the rabbits in mind. But sometimes, no matter what precautions and preparations you make, no matter how cautious you are... stuff goes wrong. And any one that breeds needsto be prepared to deal with it.

This morning was very upsetting. I had three Flemish girls due between yesterday and today. (I breed 2-3 girls at a time, so I have foster moms available in case of emergencies or unforeseen circumstances.) The girl that was due yesterday probably "missed". No babies.

But Pele, one of my white girls kindled this morning. She is a first time mom... but a sweet, gentle girl... I was in the barn early, keeping an eye on her. Didn't want to "hover", might upset her. She paid me no mind anyway. Everything looked fine. Hopped in the box, pulled enough fur for 3 litters! Looked like she was delivering with no problems, pulling off the sacks... In 15 minutes, she hopped out. I waited a few minutes to make sure she was done, but she was busy cleaning herself up. Gave her a sprig of parsley and pulled the nest box out.

Well... she had 7... and ate 5 of them... the inside of the nest box was a bloody mess... pieces of bunnies, mostly skulls,all over the place.... All that in20 minutes! And I was standing right there!!!! (No, I do not think my presence caused it... she is very used to me.) I found two babies at the back of the box, very badly bruised but alive. (They are inside ina heated box now... but I'm not holding outmuch hope that they will survive. They are in very bad shape. IF they make it andIFother doe "comes in" I'll foster them.)

I removed the nest box... and cleaned it all out. It was most definitely not a pleasant task... and I don't care how many rabbits I have, or how many litters I get... it's a difficult thing to deal with. (I still cry...) And I took ALL the precautions we have discussed in other threads... (and then some!) ...but weneedto understand that "stuff" goes wrong... very wrong sometimes. And we have to be ready for it. (Physically, emotionally andfinancially...) If anything had happened to Pele, I'd havetaken the day from work ($), rushed her over to the vets ($) and hoped for a good outcome.:pray:

I'm lucky and very, veryhappy that Pele is fine. She's munching on her hay and eating her pellets already. If you ask me if I would breed her again,honestly, probably yes. She was a first time mom, inexperienced, not ready accept the babies. Will she do better next time? I hope so. (But I also have her mom and half-sister and know that she comes from a longline with excellent maternal skills.)

(By the way... any doe of mine that does it a second time, gets spayed and placed in a pet home. Not all rabbitshave good maternal skillsand not all rabbits should or need to be mothers.) Pele is the only rabbit I kept from her litter and the only descendant I have from her father.. Yes, she is a mostoutstanding Flemish girl. Yes, I want to pass on her genes. And Yes, I have homes lined up for anybabies I have.

Just something to think about beforeanyone decides to breed a special companion bunny... it's not always sweet, fuzzy babies and joy.You have to be ready to deal with whatever happens, even if it makes you cry.




 
Oh no :(

I hate that part of breeding and I don't think I could deal with it :(

I'm so sorry you had to have that happen. I wish there was a way to know what to expect from does when they kindle.

:hug:

 
Aw I hate when things go wrong, It's sad, but to be honest stuff like that doesn't bother me, I see it all the time, never with buns though, I hope it goes well next time.
 
Thanks... :(. Today is not one of my happier days.... I just want everyone to understand that even though everyone LOVES:hearts:baby bunnies and even though webeg to see photo's of the new litters and babies, things can go very wrong.No matter how much experience you have, no matter how prepared you are. People need to evaluate their priorities before they breed and make sure they are capable of doing the right thing, especially for the rabbits, no matter what happens.
 
BlueGiants wrote:
Thanks... :(. Today is not one of my happier days.... I just want everyone to understand that even though everyone LOVES:hearts:baby bunnies and even though webeg to see photo's of the new litters and babies, things can go very wrong.No matter how much experience you have, no matter how prepared you are. People need to evaluate their priorities before they breed and make sure they are capable of doing the right thing, especially for the rabbits, no matter what happens.
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Here, here..same with any animal really, we once had a chicken kill all her babies, you can't dwell on it too much..if you don' t have a strong stomach then breeding anything isn't a good idea...what happened to you is justmother nature.
 
I am so sorry. I hope that those two hang on to life. And that your other doe has babies so she can foster them.

:pray:
 
:hug:Cathy what a horrble day for you. Its awful when something like that happens. Its always so surprising how quickly it can go from being a happy event to a sad event. I always find first litters are a breath holder as you never know what will happen.
 
Cathy, as sad as it is, I can say that I appreciate your talking to the board about it. People don't think about the possible problems all the time and jump into something they aren't ready for. It's very honorable of you to share the story when you didn't have to at all.




 
How are you Cathy? Any news on the other does?
 
I'm so sorry, Cathy. I know I was really upset when two of Jazzy's babies were born dead and had some bite marks in from her pulling them out. I can't even imagine what you went through.

:hug:

How is the third doe doing? Are the surviving babies still hanging on? Dora taught me not to give up till they were actually gone.
 
Sorry to hear about Pele's litter. It really stinks when that happens. Hopefully she does better next time.

Roger
 
Cathy,

I'm so sorry for your losses. How heartbreaking ... to be looking forward to a litter - knowing its being born...waiting those 20 minutes...and then finding what you found. I've been there many times - maybe not the exact same situation (I don't think flemish can give birth to peanuts) - but I've had a decent number of first time mamas either overgroom their babies (so I had to put them down) or kill their babies. Stupid thing is...usually its my sweetest does...they just don't seem to "get it" for the first litter sometimes.

When I first started breeding - I was told that lionheads were "easy" to breed and have them give birth successfully....because you don't get the stuck kits as often as you do with Netherland Dwarfs or Holland Lops.

Unfortunately - they didn't tell me about peanuts...about runts that fail to thrive...about those dreaded "Max Factor" babies that are deformed...or about first time mamas who kill their litters.

I cried every time I lost a baby - and I told Art early on, "The day I don't cry over losing a litter is the day you make me give up breeding" (and he agreed). We also agreed that the day I start wanting babies more than wanting what is best for the mama - it was time for me to quit too. (I quit before I reached either of those points).

I wish this thread was required (or at least highly recommended) reading for everyone who wanted to breed....to see what can happen.

Like you - I've had mamas do this. Cordelia did it to some of her first litter and so I took them away from her and then only took them to her at nursing time (and had her nurse them on our bed)...until their eyes were open. Once they were about four or five days old...she was pretty good with them - but I wasn't going to risk it. I figured she'd be a good mama....not so. Her second litter - she did the exact same thing. I really just think she wasn't cut out to be a mama.

Anyway - enough rambling - I'm so sorry for the day you've had and I'm sorry you lost the babies. However, as bad as this may sound - I'm glad they passed on their own vs. you having to put them down. I've had to do that a few times and I cried (and Art cried) every time. (No - I will not discuss how I did it on the forum).

I hope that your other mama has a nice litter and has her milk come in. Have you considered (if she has a good litter) fostering a few with Pele - perhaps taking them to her at nursing time for the first few days till you see if she'll take care of them? It might be a chance to see if she will mother a litter once they are successfulliy born. I did that with a few does - some would take care of the litter and then go on to have more litters successfully...other does...? I think they just didn't get the mothering gene (I'm saying that sarcastically).

You'll be in my thoughts and prayers over the weekend - and we really do need to see pictures of your older babies....LOTS of pictures...

[align=center]please?
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how awful for you :(i really wouldnt be cut out to be breeder i cried after loosing my does litter through handrearing because she stopped producing milk. but finding that much have been truelly heartbreaking i dont think anyone at any age couldc ope seeing something like that :(

a breeder near me who breeds lionheads lost his Lionhead doe giving birth to a big baby he came down in teh morning and the poor girl was lying dead in her hutch the baby still in the birth canal :(

i really hope those who do want to breed read this first i know if id read this 5 years agowhen i wanted babies id have changed my mind.



*hugs to you*
 
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