Cramp, gas, seizure or what?

[Clyde42483]

Piper is a 3 yr old Dutch. He has episodes, for lack of a better term, about once a month on average. The episodes come on without warning signs. During an episode, Piper bends his body to the left and holds with tense muscles for 5-10 seconds. Then he does it to the right. He draws up his limbs in flexion and rolls onto his side or back. The process repeats several times and then he relaxes after a couple of minutes of the acute phase. He lays still, apparently relaxed for a minute or two and then he gets up and hops across the room as though nothing happened. Then he's fine the rest of the day. Diet consists of Timothy hay, orchard grass, oxbow adult rabbit food (pellets) Italian parsley, kale and small amounts of steel cut oatmeal. I'm trying to figure out what is causing these episodes. Vet hasn't been able to help much, except to confirm that he's got nothing abnormal on exam. Any ideas? Thanks.

 

[JBun]

It does sound like it could be a seizure. How long has this been going on? How long has he been with you? Any other odd symptoms going on, like increased thirst/urination, increased or decreased appetite, weight loss, muscle weakness or balance issues at other times?

https://wabbitwiki.com/wiki/Seizures
Did the vet do any blood work or xrays? Or did the vet mention the possibility of e. cuniculi?

 

[Clyde42483]

It does sound like it could be a seizure. How long has this been going on? How long has he been with you? Any other odd symptoms going on, like increased thirst/urination, increased or decreased appetite, weight loss, muscle weakness or balance issues at other times?

https://wabbitwiki.com/wiki/Seizures
Did the vet do any blood work or xrays? Or did the vet mention the possibility of e. cuniculi?

Thanks for the reply. Piper has been with me since he was 3 months old. He's just over 3 years old now. His intake, output and activity levels have all been normal. His weight is stable at about 7.5 lbs. There's been no odd symptoms like balance problems or head tilt. Vet has done fecal exams which were negative. I've taken him to the vet on two occasions immediately after an episode. Both times (2 different vets) his exam was normal. Piper has had 13 of these episodes in the past year. Although it could be seizures, it doesn't present with the classic tonic-clonic movement that one sees in grand mal seizures and nor with the "absence" one sees in petit mal seizures. I'm not denying the possibility, but I'm stumped. One vet thinks it's a gas problem and another calls it cramps. Haven't had xrays or blood work done. My vet said he could run some tests but he wasn't clear on which tests to run. I can't blame him because every time he's seen Piper, the exam has been normal. I can't see putting him through a bunch of tests just to be able to say that we tested everything, but I wouldn't deny him testing that the vet felt would be useful either. I'm just stumped.

 

[JBun]

I would still suspect seizure, even though it seems to present differently. If you look at that link, there are some videos of some rabbits having seizures, and some of them are different than expected. The rabbits remain upright and even possibly semi aware of their surroundings. But they are clearly having a seizure episode of some sort.

With gas and abdominal discomfort, every instance I've seen or read of presented very differently, and usually a much more extended time period. I guess it's still possible, but just doesn't seem to fit from what you're describing.

There are other possibilities, like ingestion of a toxin, or maybe something heart related, that could possibly present with similar symptoms, but I wouldn't expect to see such a sudden recovery after the episode if it was one of these.

Because it's not a persistent problem, but is happening sporadically only about once a month, I wouldn't necessarily want to be too aggressive trying to find a cause either. But clearly something is going on, so it would be good to try and figure it out before it worsens, if possible. And if you do see an increase in occurrences, I would definitely suggest having more testing done. There are meds that may help if it becomes a more persistent issue, if it is actually a seizure that's happening.

One of the more common causes of seizures in rabbits, is e. cuniculi. So trying the treatment for that just based on symptoms, might be something to consider. Another slight possibility could be toxoplasmosis, if your rabbit is around cats at all.

If you can catch a video of an episode, that might be helpful in determining what exactly is going on with your bun, whether it is a seizure or something else.

 

[Clyde42483]

Thanks. I'm trying to catch video when it occurs. If I get something useful I'll share it here as well as with the vet. I'm hopeful that we can figure out how to prevent, or at least minimize these episodes.