Confused about new rabbit laws...

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Hill-Hutch

Hill-Hutch

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Jul 19, 2011
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Location
Pocatello, Idaho, USA
So, I've been reading about the possible(?) new laws on animal sales and I'm extremely confused.
does this only apply to those breeders with more than 5 breeding rabbits( 4 does and 1 buck)?
Is the new limit for small breeders 1 buck and 5 breeding does and after that they need a license?

A local Rex breeder was telling us that it would be $50 to get a license for every rabbit a person owns... but they do meat rabbits and they said something about USDA and FDA inspections and stuff...

I'm extremely confused and would appreciate if someone would dumb it down for me and make it a bit easier to understand.

I really wanted to start my own rabbitry, but we currently have 5 pet rabbits (3 bucks and 2 does) and I'm not exactly sure about the laws.

Thanks guys!
~Sydnie
 
I understood it as 5 breeding (brood? i think they're called)does max. It didnt specify males. It also says that if you sell a kit sight unseen that you're pretty much considered a commercial breeder.

I'm not a breeder though, hoping others chime in.
 
So if I just post a picture of my rabbit on the internet or just a description of him and say, ok, this rabbit is for sale for $35 and I'll ship him to you for $40 more, That would be considered selling him "sight-unseen"?

By commercial breeder, they mean like meat, fur, laboratory rabbits right?
 
Hill-Hutch wrote:
So if I just post a picture of my rabbit on the internet or just a description of him and say, ok, this rabbit is for sale for $35 and I'll ship him to you for $40 more, That would be considered selling him "sight-unseen"?

By commercial breeder, they mean like meat, fur, laboratory rabbits right?
Click to expand...
Yea, that's sight unseen.

Commercial breeder means you do it for profit, like you would sell to the pet stores that sell to the public. They work on a larger scale than a back yard breeder.

Again, im not positive, i didnt research or anything, this is just my understanding... just giving you my disclaimer lol
 
Thanks Julie! The article kind of dumbed it down a little more!

I guess it will make more sense when my mom and dad read it.
 
Okay, this is the current concern on the show bunny list. Before, you had to have a license if you sold to pet stores and labs. They are trying to change it so that it's anyone that sells over $500, including for show and for pet.

The way the current proposal is written, that $500 comes from anywhere you sell your rabbits that's off your property. Most of the big rabbitries sell most of their animals at shows or a parking lot (so people can't see where they are housed and how they are taken care of...supposedly because there are too many Animal Rights Activists that would report them for "trumped up charges".). This total would also include any animal that you sell online and then someone else comes and picks up.

According to ARBA, they said that the totals wouldn't come into play unless the buyer doesn't see the actual animal first. But that's NOT how the proposal reads.

What I find ironic is that retail pet stores don't need licensing. But individual breeders, who sell "to the public" need to be.

If you raise animals for meat and/or fiber, you won't need a license. If you only sell animals from your home, you won't need a license. If you sell $500 of animals at shows, internet sales, or pet stores you will.

This goes for any domesticated animal, including horses.

I'm torn on this issue. I'm a small breeder, and my rabbits don't sell for nearly what some get ($250/rabbit). I probably wouldn't need a license, even with the new proposal.

I see the need for some sort of inspections/standards. There are MANY breeders out there that aren't keeping cages clean, keeping clean water always available, food, etc. But to require every single rabbit breeder to basically have lab-type equipment is ludicrous.

But right now this is a slippery slope. If this passes, it just paves the way to even stricter guidelines, higher licensing fees, and a broader scope of what you can and can not do with your pets, show stock, livestock, etc. Remember, those ARAs are the ones that don't want to see a single pet in any home...and you can bet they're behind the majority of this proposal's plan.
 
Oh, and in regards to the link from Rabbit Smarties. The family they use as their example was clearly in violation of the existing law. They were selling to retail stores without having a license. They weren't selling pets/show stock, it was mass quantities to a pet store.
 
wendymac wrote:
Oh, and in regards to the link from Rabbit Smarties. The family they use as their example was clearly in violation of the existing law. They were selling to retail stores without having a license. They weren't selling pets/show stock, it was mass quantities to a pet store.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. The link is there to illustrate how important it is to stay within the rules.

I'm still trying to figure this out myself, because a lot of people are saying a lot of different things about it.

To the person who said five animals - the current limit is 3 females, and they're talking about raising it to four. The number of bucks you have isn't important.
 
All I know for sure is that politician's are greedy buffoons. They took less than 200 pages of tax code and simplified to over 400, then 800, and now more than 1400 pages and the only ones that have benefited since Reagan are the uber Rich and corporations controlled by the uber Rich, and lawyers.
 
I sent a comment in to clarify if people who raise small animals for exhibition, particularly rabbit would need a license.

But here is a factsheet posted by APHIS
http://www.aphis.usda.gov/publications/animal_welfare/2012/retail_pets_faq.pdf

Here is what they said
"Q. How will this affect retailers who sell their
animals to buyers in face-to-face transactions at a
location other than their own premises?
A. The proposed rule is designed to close a loophole
in the current regulations that allows pet animals to be
sold sight-unseen, without any oversight by the public
or APHIS. Pet animal retailers who sell their animals
to their customers in face-to-face transactions at a
location other than their own premises are subject to
some degree of public oversight and therefore are not
the focus of this proposed rule and would not need to
obtain a license."
 
woahlookitsme wrote:
I sent a comment in to clarify if people who raise small animals for exhibition, particularly rabbit would need a license.

But here is a factsheet posted by APHIS
http://www.aphis.usda.gov/publications/animal_welfare/2012/retail_pets_faq.pdf

Here is what they said
"Q. How will this affect retailers who sell their
animals to buyers in face-to-face transactions at a
location other than their own premises?
A. The proposed rule is designed to close a loophole
in the current regulations that allows pet animals to be
sold sight-unseen, without any oversight by the public
or APHIS. Pet animal retailers who sell their animals
to their customers in face-to-face transactions at a
location other than their own premises are subject to
some degree of public oversight and therefore are not
the focus of this proposed rule and would not need to
obtain a license."
Click to expand...

The problem is, that is NOT how the law is written. Are we to take their word for it? Until they change the actual wording, we're all going to be breaking it. And there isn't much "public oversight" going on if you buy a rabbit at a show/parking lot.

If they, in fact, do not wish to target show sales (or even parking lot sales, which is common when people don't want others in their rabbitry), then why is it even included in the law?
 
I think they consider the fact that you're making the sale at a rabbit show as "some degree of public oversight" because shows aren't closed to the public (usually). The public is welcome and we typically have families ask us questions about our rabbits. Other rabbit exhibitors would be considered the "public" also, as opposed to a private sale where noone else is around except you and the buyer.

I don't trust what these interpretations of the proposedlaw mean until they change the wording and make it more clear.
 
majorv wrote:
I don't trust what these interpretations of the proposed law mean until they change the wording and make it more clear.
Click to expand...

That's what most of us are saying. It leaves too much control for someone with an agenda. Hopefully this won't go through until the wording is changed to reflect their intended intentions.
 
There was an excellent summary in the ARBA Domestic Rabbits magazine written by the ARBA Legislation Committee. The change in the law is to update a law existing since the 1970's to include internet sales.
 
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