Advice on bonding and getting a second bunny

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Orrac1e

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Singapore, , Singapore
Hi guys!

We've been thinking about this for sometime and would like some advice. My current bunny, Binky is an ND currently over a year old, has been spayed, and we were considering getting a mate for her!

I've done some reading and the general consensus is that the best pairing is Male/female. I've had my eye on a little male bunny about 2 months old and was wondering if he'd be a good fit for her? I know these things are unpredictable, but i was wondering if my current set up could make things more difficult as my current bunny sort of gets "free range" of the bathroom and occasionally our rooms. She has a cage although its more of the potty place.

We hope to have both bunnies living free range in the bathroom together, but current problems i can think of are:

1) The "territory" belongs to Binky, and i'd be introducing the newcomer into her space, i read somewhere that females are more territorial and this could pose a problem. Would introducing a younger male make her less aggressive?

2) But that would mean the male bunny is un-neuetered, what happens when he starts getting hormonal? (lol)

Lastly, how long does the process of bonding usually take on average?

Thanks and i do appreciate any advice in advance! I'm trying to be as well prepared before going into this.
 
Sorry i forgot the add that the second bunny we are considering is a holland lop and he'll probably grow to twice the size of my current bunny :S
 
Is there a way you can let Binky meet the boy bunny (on neutral territory) to see how she reacts? That might help you decide.
 
Predicting outcomes can be iffy when one bunny's juvenile and the other's an adult, since you can't really see his true personality yet. M/F is often considered the easiest, but others (myself included) think gender is less important than personality - the easiest pair to bond involves one dominant and one submissive bunny (I have a F/F pair, one very bossy and the other very submissive).

Out of curiosity, what's your current bunny (weight and/or breed) that you expect him to end up so much bigger? When breeding Hollands, about 2/3 of the viable offspring are dwarves and the other 1/3 doesn't get the dwarf gene (the odds are originally 50% and 25% of inheriting one copy/not inheriting the gene; the other 25% get two copies which is a lethal combination (peanuts)). A Holland with the dwarf gene is only 2-3 lbs, so they're quite small... not sure if you can tell at 2 mos whether a Holland has the gene or not, though. My Holland does not and weighs in at 4 lbs 12 oz, which is indeed a pretty big bunny compared to the truly small breeds.

Anyway, back to the topic... when he starts getting hormonal, it can upset their bond and require them to be separated until as much as 6-8 weeks after he's been neutered; however, if you can set it up so that they can see/smell each other without being able to fight through cage/pen bars, you can preserve their bond to some degree.

Normally, I strongly recommend doing "bunny dates" (with adult bunnies) at a shelter that allows them and letting the current bunny pick their companion... however, I see you're in Singapore and I suspect that may not be an option there. If it isn't, then you can try to arrange a play-date with the juvenile male you've got your eye on. Do your best to gauge personalities - do they both want to be dominant, or is one willing to be submissive?

With any two bunnies, there's always a chance they won't bond (another reason to go through shelters that allow bunny-dates, as they'll pretty much always allow you to return the second bunny if things don't work out). You have to be willing to accept the risk that they may never bond and will always have to be kept apart. However, if you're patient and determined enough to stick it out even if it takes months (or longer), the odds are in your favor. If bonding goes badly, you can separate them (so they can't see or smell each other) for 3-4 weeks to "reboot" the bonding process and get a fresh start - with a very tough pair, it may take more than one reboot to achieve a bond (most people who go through a shelter give up before this point and exchange the bunny for one that their bunny is more receptive to).

The trickiest thing with bonding in your case will be finding neutral territory for them to do bonding sessions on, since she free-roams so much. Living on territory that was originally hers isn't really a big deal once they're bonded (especially if you let him have access to areas that are "hers" while she's not in them so that they smell like both bunnies) but for the earlier stages of the bonding process, it's crucial to work with them in an area neither bunny has been in before. If there's no place in your home where she hasn't been, an x-pen set up outside when the weather is nice (either on concrete or on grass that hasn't been treated with fertilizer or pesticides) or set up at a friend or neighbor's house (if you know someone who loves bunnies) can work.

These sites have great bonding info:
http://www.wheekwheekthump.com/?s=bonding (numerous wonderful articles)
http://www.cottontails-rescue.org.uk/matchups.asp
http://www.rabbitnetwork.org/articles/bond.shtml
http://www.examiner.com/article/bunny-bonding-part-iii-bonding-challenges
 
I tried bonding my bunnies when they were both adults. One is about twice the size of the other and just dominates the other rabbit. The poor small rabbit hides whenever he sees the big one. I don't know what to do.

I would say go for it, and get the male neutered at the beginning of his "teenager" months. Good luck! :D
 
Thank you so much for the responses!

@ Imbrium- Size wise, after speaking to one of the breeders he assured me the difference wouldn't be too drastic. We saw a 5 month bunny who was already larger than Binky who is over a year, so we assumed he was just going to get much bigger! Also we found out the new bun is 4 months instead of just 2, so he's quite tiny for his age.

I've scouted a few bunny breeders and pet stores, and the male bunny i'm considering seems extremely docile compared to ANY of the others i've seen. He's such a sleepyhead and fell asleep in our arms, we've fallen quite in love with him. Binky in contrast is active, we call her the tornado because she dashes around pulling out stacks of papers, rips carpets, and quite dislikes being picked up (but she loves a good pat) so i'm inclined to think he'd be the more submissive one although i could be totally wrong.

A bunny date would be ideal, a few of the breeders have suggested such arrangements, but unfortunately the place where this bun belongs to is a pet store so i don't know about their policies. The staff do not seem too knowledgeable, and for that reason I'm a little concerned about putting Binky together before getting the other bunny checked out for mites etc. I know the breeder would have been a much better choice but we weren't "feeling" any of the bunnies there and this one just melted our hearts.

As for the territory, i was planning to put new bun in my room during the bonding period, while Binky lives in the bathroom nearby. Would it okay if she picks up his scent and vice versa or would that just send them into territorial mode? I'd definitely find neutral ground during the introduction meetings. Also Binky's toilet training has been immaculate from the day we got her, would having another bunny who poops around mess up her good habits?

It's getting hard at this point not to be impulsive, but due to space and other factors, we're really trying to weigh the pros/cons of getting a second bunny. Thanks a lot for your help!
 
Hi I am in the process of taking a break from a bad bonding process. I have a rabbit who is almost 1 year old and back in Aug I decided I wanted to get him a companion and I wanted a rabbit for myself as well. being I lived too far from a rabbit rescue I bought a cute baby bunny instead. I thought I could do pre bonding things while I waited for her to be old enough to spay and that they could get use to each other via side by side cage meetings. That didn't work as I thought it would. I am lucky to have 2 spare rooms so in case I cant get them bonded she has a place to live. That is something you should think about. I woud read up on bonding as much as you can before you consider getting another rabbit. The process of bonding doesn't have a set time it could take weeks it could take months. I would wait at least a month after he is neutered to even try to bond. I wish you the best of luck!
Sindri
 
I timed out last time I made my post Imbrium has given you some great advice and links that I have also found useful. I hope they work for you!
 
Thanks for sharing! It sounds like a pretty similar situation. And believe it or not, I didn't even notice the links?! I have this bad tendency to tune out links or text of different colours. The links are a great help, so thank you imbrium!
 
A bunny date would be ideal, a few of the breeders have suggested such arrangements, but unfortunately the place where this bun belongs to is a pet store so i don't know about their policies. The staff do not seem too knowledgeable, and for that reason I'm a little concerned about putting Binky together before getting the other bunny checked out for mites etc.

Based on your description of their personalities, it sounds very likely that they would be a good match. I agree 100% about being wary of the bunny's source - shelters and good breeders go to great lengths to keep their animals very healthy and illness/parasite free; pet stores... not so much. I think it's a really good idea to trust your instincts on the quality of the pairing and to get him checked out by a rabbit-savvy vet before you think about letting him near your bunny.

Also, I recommend doing a quarantine for at least two weeks in case there's any dormant/hidden health issues that get missed at the vet check-up. In other words, keep him isolated from your bunny, wash your hands after handling him, etc. While it errs on the side of being overly cautious, that's not really a bad thing - we had another member get a new bunny recently who appeared healthy at first, but then started having seizures (a few days to a week after coming home) and she passed away so quickly there wasn't even time to get her to a vet.

As for the territory, i was planning to put new bun in my room during the bonding period, while Binky lives in the bathroom nearby. Would it okay if she picks up his scent and vice versa or would that just send them into territorial mode? I'd definitely find neutral ground during the introduction meetings. Also Binky's toilet training has been immaculate from the day we got her, would having another bunny who poops around mess up her good habits?

It's more likely that her habits would be "messed up" because of territorial marking than anything, and that settles down after a while. If you choose to quarantine and do a thorough job, then she wouldn't be smelling his scent in areas where she roams (though she'll almost certainly still be able to smell him to some degree from a distance and be aware that there's another bunny in the house).

After bringing him home, make sure she gets as much attention as always and do your best to maintain any routines she may have - that way she doesn't see him as a threat to her current lifestyle and doesn't feel like she needs to compete with him to have things the way she likes them.

After quarantine ends or if you decide you're comfortable skipping it, then it's actually a good thing to have them smelling each other in "their" areas prior to the first introduction. This lets them gradually become familiar with each others' scents. With sugar gliders, pouch (sleeping spot) and toy swapping is always done before intros (the introduction process is very similar to bunnies).

Scent mingling does tend to make animals a bit territorial at first, but territorial urges inevitably have to be overcome at some point when bringing a new bunny home to an existing bunny - scent mingling and toy/bed/litter box swapping are good ways to let them get the territorial urges out of their systems. The issue you're most likely to encounter is a "poop war" along the boundary between their areas (for example, if you have a baby gate or something across the door to your room at some point so they can start getting to know each other).

It's getting hard at this point not to be impulsive, but due to space and other factors, we're really trying to weigh the pros/cons of getting a second bunny. Thanks a lot for your help!

Depending on whether you quarantine, how long you do it for if you do, how long you do scent-swapping for and the age at which your vet is willing to neuter, it may end up being best to keep them separated until after the neuter. Here, vets will typically neuter as soon as a male's testicles descend (usually around 3 months of age, which is only a month away).

Assuming he can be neutered around 3 months of age, I would do scent-swapping and, once the territorial whatnot starts to die down, start doing bonding sessions... but I would wait until after the neuter to consider letting them actually live together.

Post-neuter, I'd give him about a week to recover without any playdates (still doing scent swapping), then go back to bonding sessions *if* he's not acting really hormonal and they don't get into any altercations during the sessions that you think may be caused by hormones. If hormones seem to be an issue, take a break for 2-3 weeks and then try again.

While it *can* take 6-8 weeks for a male's hormones to be completely gone, that's the maximum - it doesn't always take that long. Also, neutering when he's very young means he's just hitting puberty and his hormones may not kick in fully so they may dissipate faster.

Honestly, you've put enough thought into this that I certainly wouldn't consider it impulsive. You seem to know your girl very well and know how to listen to your instincts when meeting another bunny/gauging if he would be a good fit. It sounds like your instincts are telling you that this male bunny is "the one" - while inexplicable, instincts are very often right. I feel very strongly that instincts are worth listening to - sometimes you can know something without knowing, if that makes any sense.

I actually picked out Nala and Gaz by instinct; I couldn't possibly have explained at the time why I picked them for myself or for each other (and in retrospect, I honestly think that Nala picked ME and possibly picked Gaz as well o_O)... yet I ended up with a "best case" scenario by blindly trusting my gut. Actually, every time I've personally selected an animal to give a forever home to, the choice was ultimately made based on instinct (with my breeding gliders, genetics/pedigrees and such obviously narrowed down the options significantly but even then, I've trusted my instinct to make a final choice from my short-list of suitable matches).

If I were you, I'd give the little guy the best present any bunny could ask for - a "forever" home!

Hopefully the bonding process (and his neuter) go very smoothly... but if you run into any trouble, we'll certainly do our best to help! :D
 
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Thanks for sharing! It sounds like a pretty similar situation. And believe it or not, I didn't even notice the links?! I have this bad tendency to tune out links or text of different colours. The links are a great help, so thank you imbrium!

Lol, whoops... hope it doesn't throw you off that, in the post I just made, I commented within the quote of your post and differentiated my thoughts by using a different color! ><
 
Also, I'd like to share two excellent articles on introducing sugar gliders. Obviously, some of the details simply don't apply to bunnies (and the normal quarantine recommendation with bunnies is two weeks rather than 30 days), but the overall bonding process is strikingly similar and the articles are well-written, so I think they're worth skimming through :).

http://thegliderinitiative.webs.com/introducing_gliders.pdf (start with the final paragraph on page 1)
http://thegliderinitiative.webs.com/safe_intro_article.pdf (see notes below)

Notes on the second link:
Skip step 1 and go to the "fourth week" part of step 2, since you're not using cages.
Step 3 is about bonding pouches, so it's irrelevant to bunnies.
Step 6 isn't really feasible since you're not using cages and your girl is free-range. I would clean the litter box and perhaps food dishes/hay manger that they'll be using thoroughly right before putting them together so that they don't smell like either bunny, but there's no way you can de-scent your whole home and I can't see it being worth trying to. As long as you don't try to put them together for real too soon, I really don't think it will matter.
As much as the guide stresses the importance of step 6, I've honestly never bothered to do it with sugar gliders and have *never* had a problem (I've been through the process five times now), even when adding a male to a female's cage... which I attribute to being a good judge of when a pair is truly ready to move in together.
 
Haha! I definitely didn't miss those big chunks of text :) I frequent some forums and sometimes people have signatures with crazy colours and multiple links to their websites (might be guilty of that too), so those are the kind i tend to tune out :D

Thanks a lot for all the links and advice, you've been SUCH a great help! I'm still talking it over with my brother and BF who now thinks it may be a bad idea. The first line we read from the link you gave was "what happens if they just Do Not Bond".. My parents allow playtime around the house, but they draw the line at keeping the living space to our area (talk about territorial, hah!) so practical space that is well ventilated etc is quite an issue for us. The best space is the fairly large bathroom that Binky has to herself, i was hoping to simply have the cage of the new bun in there where she roams, but now i've read its highly inadvisable should they fight through the grids.. so we've really gotta figure out how to make this work! If i do get the bun i'll definitely update with pics :) Thanks again!
 
Jennifer has great advice and lots of good links.

I just wanted to reiterate what she said earlier about ideal bonding. I too agree with this. And since you just posted a concern about what could happen if they don't bond, I'd especially give this consideration.

...and that is, that ideally, it is best to allow a spayed girl to bunny-date an already fixed boy from a rescue. Are rescues available where you live? Otherwise, the idea of dating from those breeders that allow it is that it prevents you from being 'stuck' with 2 rabbits that won't bond. They usually allow you to exchange the one rabbit if he just won't get along with your girl.

So if having 2 rabbits that won't bond would be a problem, then it may be better to play it safer and go through a place that will help you find a compatible mate.
 

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