Very difficult moral dilemma, any ideas?

[bunnihon]

Ineed some help.

I have been helping at a rabbit place for a few weeks and although Ienjoy it, I feelthat I have stumbled on something that Idon't know how to sort out. The person who runs the place mainly breedsrabbits for shows and for selling as pets, but also takes in abandonedbuns and trys to rehome them,and also pet sits the bunswhilst people go on holiday. (I didn't realise abouyt the breedingbefore I went there).

Howevre, when I clean out the buns, I found that the cages were verydirty and that the buns rarely if ever get any exercise, (other thanwhen the cages are being cleaned). The buns are all actually in goodhealth and I haven't seen any sores or any real neglet. BUT I fell verystrongly that they just dont get enough exercise, and they are in verysmall hutches/cages. The person has sooo many buns (as well as otheranimals such as guineas, mice, rats etc) I dont actually know how theycope.

The thing is this person is a total rabbit fanatic and really does careloads for the buns, they have toys, and of course are well generallywell watered and fed. But the bunsjust stay in their cagesfor days on end. And I dont think this is right. I couldnt sleep fortwo nighjts as I was so worried about it.

The thing is I cant exactly start telling this person I dont think theyshould be breeding all these buns. The preson says that the profit justkeeps the place ticking over, but I know that many of the buns justdont get the attention they need.

I have been away for a week due to personal reasons, but i am worriedabout going back. I know the buns need the cuddles I give them and Iwork really hard to try and get some order into the place. The personis just very disorganised and doesnt seem to see the obvious. I havedecided to keep going until I hopefully havemade some impactto make things better, but I come home feeling so sad for the buns Ihave left there, knowing that they probably wont get much if anyexercise until the next week that I am there. It does make me veryupset.

Does anyone have any advice on what to do in such a situation?

 

[bunnysgalore]

I know I would feel exactly the same.Can you sort of just sort of say "shall I let some of the bunnys outfor a bit of a run round" as if you thought that's what always happenedand was normal practice?

 

[louiseh]

Hi Folks,



I'm new to this forum. Unfortunately it is a very sad sad day. My blackNetherlands Dwarf Sable died this morning. I am totally heart broken.

 

[Bo B Bunny]

I would suggest an excercise schedule.

Does she have a run for them? Do you know how many there are in total?

Is this person a legit business or is it just something she does on a personal level?

 

[Buck Jones]

louiseh wrote:

Hi Folks,



I'm new to this forum. Unfortunately it is a very sad sad day. My blackNetherlands Dwarf Sable died this morning. I am totally heart broken.

So sorry your bun has passed away. If you are not familiarwith the concept of the Rainbow Bridge, please linktohttp://www.lisaviolet.com/ecard/rainbowjavax.html

It won't change anything, but it might serve to provide some consolation as it has done for many of us in similar situations.

Buck

 

[Buck Jones]

bunnihon wrote:

The buns are all actually in good health and I haven't seenany sores or any real neglet. BUT I fell very strongly that they justdont get enough exercise, and they are in very smallhutches/cages....

The thing is this person is a total rabbit fanatic and really does careloads for the buns, they have toys, and of course are well generallywell watered and fed. But the bunsjust stay in their cagesfor days on end....

The thing is I cant exactly starttelling this person I dont think they should be breeding all thesebuns. The preson says that the profit just keeps the place tickingover, but I know that many of the buns just dont get the attention theyneed.

...I know the buns need the cuddles I give them and I work really hardto try and get some order into the place. The person is just verydisorganised and doesnt seem to see the obvious. I have decided to keepgoing until I hopefully havemade some impact to make thingsbetter, but I come home feeling so sad for the buns I have left there,knowing that they probably wont get much if any exercise until the nextweek that I am there....

Does anyone have any advice on what to do in such a situation?

It would appear, if what you say is true, that there is little going onthat an SPCA or animal control person would be able to take issue with,so "going to law" is probably not going to change anything unless thereare entirely too many animals being housed in one place as percommunity livestock laws.

Many rabbits survive in worse situations and it seems these rabbits dohave a potential chance to be sold or re-homed into a bettercircumstance and that their present condition is a temporary one.

The longer you stay with the person providing help and assistance, themore your opinion would be of value to her and the less judgmental youwould appear. Your participation helps the buns,regardless of how much, it still does provide them some attention andexercise. The net effect is a positive one.

I would advise continuing along in that vane until you have been therefor a while to get a better perspective and to make more ofan impression upon the person when you do suggest a reduction in sizefor breeding or rescuing.

People often resent comments from those who have not walked in theirshoes for a bit and will often take criticism more readily from peoplethey know and have learned to trust because of having walked along withthem in those circumstances.

Major thing to consider...are the animals better off where they arenow, given the potential for sale/re-homing, than if this facility werebrought to a halt? If so, work on the reduction of the scopeof the operation after you've been there for a while and yoursuggestion(s) hold more import to the person running it.

IMHO

Buck

 

[Pipp]

So sorry about your sable, Louise, I've got a little black one of my own.

How long did you have her? What happened to her? Do you have any others?

Again, so sorry.



louiseh wrote:

Hi Folks,



I'm new to this forum. Unfortunately it is a very sad sad day. My blackNetherlands Dwarf Sable died this morning. I am totally heart broken.

 

[bluebird]

Im very sorry about your bunny Louise.bluebird

 

[louiseh]

Thankyou for the reply, I feel so slighted by thevet. Shiraz, my little bunny had just been spayed on Friday I pickedher up on Sat. I couldn't get her to eat the supplement and she passedaway early Monday. No word from the vet, since I dropped her off therefor creamation.

 

[louiseh]

Hi, and thankyou for the kind words. I had Shirazfor a little over 5 yrs. She had never had anyproblems until lastThursday. I miss her so. Our house feels so empty with out her. Our 2kitties kept looking for her last night.

 

[louiseh]

Thanks, I miss my bunny!!!

 

[black_jack]

bunnihon wrote:

Ineed some help.

I have been helping at a rabbit place for a few weeks and although Ienjoy it, I feelthat I have stumbled on something that Idon't know how to sort out. The person who runs the place mainly breedsrabbits for shows and for selling as pets, but also takes in abandonedbuns and trys to rehome them,and also pet sits the bunswhilst people go on holiday. (I didn't realise abouyt the breedingbefore I went there).

Howevre, when I clean out the buns, I found that the cages were verydirty and that the buns rarely if ever get any exercise, (other thanwhen the cages are being cleaned). The buns are all actually in goodhealth and I haven't seen any sores or any real neglet. BUT I fell verystrongly that they just dont get enough exercise, and they are in verysmall hutches/cages. The person has sooo many buns (as well as otheranimals such as guineas, mice, rats etc) I dont actually know how theycope.

The thing is this person is a total rabbit fanatic and really does careloads for the buns, they have toys, and of course are well generallywell watered and fed. But the bunsjust stay in their cagesfor days on end. And I dont think this is right. I couldnt sleep fortwo nighjts as I was so worried about it.

The thing is I cant exactly start telling this person I dont think theyshould be breeding all these buns. The preson says that the profit justkeeps the place ticking over, but I know that many of the buns justdont get the attention they need.

I have been away for a week due to personal reasons, but i am worriedabout going back. I know the buns need the cuddles I give them and Iwork really hard to try and get some order into the place. The personis just very disorganised and doesnt seem to see the obvious. I havedecided to keep going until I hopefully havemade some impactto make things better, but I come home feeling so sad for the buns Ihave left there, knowing that they probably wont get much if anyexercise until the next week that I am there. It does make me veryupset.

Does anyone have any advice on what to do in such a situation?

hmmm, you say that this person is a bunny fanatic and really caresabout rabbits but i think that maybe there is such a thing as being toofanatical and too caring.

I have two buns and they are a handful but i love them to bits..ishould really have only had the one as I am struggling to cope a bitrunning around after them lol...

she has how many? She obviously cannot provide everything they need and that has been enough to raise your concerns.

What about ringing a few of the other rabbit shelters near you sayingthat you are thinking of starting your own shelter and were wonderinghow they do it could u spend a few days working with them.

That way you can compare how each centre does it (try covering a spcacentre aswell) this way you will know whether these buns are beingtreated poorly or not and may be able to offer suggestions of how tochange things if they are?

The other option is ringing your local animal protection authority anonand ask them what they think. If what they say to you leadsyou to think what is happening is wrong then think it over and ringthem back.

Hope this helps x

 

[Buck Jones]

louiseh wrote:

Thankyou for the reply, I feel so slighted by the vet.Shiraz, my little bunny had just been spayed on Friday I picked her upon Sat. I couldn't get her to eat the supplement and she passed awayearly Monday. No word from the vet, since I dropped her off there forcreamation.

Five years old is a bit older than the optimum for a doe to undergo theprocedure. Had the vet suggested that? Loss of appetite isnot uncommon after surgery. Demise is, as less than 1% of rabbitsundergoing spay succumb to complications afterward.

A necropsy might offer reasons for the bun's untimelydeparture if requested. Perhaps, the vet's silence regardingthe matter is indicative of some of the causes.

You have my utmost sympathy under these trying circumstances.I know how one feels when something you thought was done for the healthand well being of the animal does not turn out the way oneanticipated.

You can only deal with the information as you knew it at the time andthe bun's good was the ultimate goal. I suspect sheunderstood that and waits for you at the Bridge with the rest of ourdeparted buns.

Buck

 

[louiseh]

Your picture is the spitting image of Shiraz. Ohmy God I miss her dearly. I had her 5 years, she passed away a dayaftersurgery.

 

[Pipp]

louiseh wrote:

Your picture is the spitting image of Shiraz. Oh my God Imiss her dearly. I had her 5 years, she passed away a dayaftersurgery.

If she had 'problems' on Thursday, wasthe Fridayspayingemergency surgery? Its so hard when you knowyou're losing them, they won't eatand you can't do anythingabout it. Pipp didn't start eating for ages after hersurgery, and she scared me half to death. Ican'tbear the thought oflosing her.

I think right now you needanotherbunny.I'm feeling your pain, and my little girl is being verycomforting. (Poor thing is standing in for aKeenex).

Judging by the nature of this thread (before we got sidetracked),there's another little one out there somewhere who really needs a goodhome.

Sas

 

[bunnihun]

Sorry for the delay in repsonseto allyour good advice regarding the 'moral dilemma". (My computer has beenmisbehaving, fortunately Carolyn has sorted out the problem now). BuckJones and others you have givenme things to think about.Thanks.

Thankfully it seems that some new runs are being constructed so thatthe bunnies can have some exercise! Imagine my surprise whenIwas told this.

Quite a few buns have also been rehomed, so this is also good news.However the lady still has close on 50 buns plus other anmials to takecare of. I only help once a week, but I think it does take the pressureoff her, and the bunnies get cuddles and I do my best to get thingsbetter.

Sorry to hear of you news louiseh, I hope you are feeling better. Thereare many other buns that would love you as their mummy, when you areready.