Sub Q Penicillin Injections Help

[houserabbitz]

Hi All,

My bunny has abscesses, diagnosed with pasteurella. My vet showed me how to administer the injections; tent the skin between the shoulders, and inject, done. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong, but the penicillin always ends up on my bunny's scruff. Maybe I am penetrating both layers of the "tent"? If I am too hesitant with the needle I can't penetrate the skin, should I be aiming downward? My bunny is definitely feeling better so she is getting some medication, but I hate sticking her twice because I can't seem to get it right. Any help or advice?

 

[majorv]

Sounds like you might be pulling the skin up too much. It just needs to go under the skin. Try penetrating a little lower and don't put it in very far. Did he also tell you to pull the plunger back a little bit to make sure you haven't hit a vein, before you inject the med?

 

[Flick]

When you're ready to remove the needle, place your thumb and forefinger where the needle is going into the skin then slide the needle out between your thumb and forefinger. When the needle is out, pinch the skin at the injection site between the thumb and finger and hold it for 10 or 15 seconds. You don't have to pinch hard, just enough to close the injection site so the medication won't leak out. By placing your fingers around the needle as it slides out, you'll know you're pinching the right spot.

 

[Chrisdoc]

It is a bit scary the first time, I did my first on Saturday and I´ve got to do another tonight. Just pinch the skin and put the needle in straight but don´t touch the plunger until you´ve put the needle in. Then hold the needle as you pull it out and massage where you injected. I suppose it gets easier the more you do it.

 

[houserabbitz]

Thanks for the suggestions, I think I have gotten the hang of it now; I was pulling the tent too tight.

Since she has been on the meds though, I have noticed she is acting differently. I caught her chewing the paint of the corner of a wall in our living room, and then chewing on one of my daughter's wooden toys. She doesn't chew, ever, except when eating. She has also been licking the metal bars to her x-pen. Does anyone have any idea what's going on?

 

[Chrisdoc]

Are the abscesses on her jaw or another part of her body ? Was thinking that if its the jaw, she could be helping to relieve pain or discomfort on the teeth or it could be that she's just getting her own back for giving her injections haha.
Glad you've got the hang of the injections, it does help the more you do it. I am so much more comfortable with it now after 5 days.

I am just glad mine is eating and doing the normal things, hope yours is doing well, it's stressful have a poorly bunny for you as well as for them

 

[houserabbitz]

The abscesses are along her belly area, and the biggest is under her right forearm, I guess sort of where her armpit is? She seems to be feeling better, and the abscesses are getting smaller, but not by much.
Glad your bunny is doing okay!

 

[Chrisdoc]

I had read that respond well to sub q penicilin, my vet will probably start injection of it next week for mine. He is well considering but I do worry but know he is in good hands. It is good also to be able to discuss it on here, it really does help.

 

[houserabbitz]

Daphne seemed to be doing better at first, and now the abscess is leaking, and smells. I don't know what to do. Tomorrow is the last day of her penicillin, I am going to call and get a refill. I don't know if the abscess has burst, but it is open, the vet said it would do this. She isn't eating well. Advice?

 

[Chrisdoc]

Are you draining ir regularly. You should be and also keep your bun as clean as you can as you should avoid them ingesting the pus. I am also packing the abscessvwith honey as it helps break down the pus and makes it easier to drain. I am doing this a least two ot three times a day.

 

[houserabbitz]

The abscess isn't going away, and now it's hard and brown. Daphne is losing mobility on her right hind end, the same side of her body as the abscess. She is still eating and drinking and lucid. I am taking her to the vet on Wednesday, but I don't know if her prognosis is good. With her now dragging her leg, I am losing hope.

 

[Chrisdoc]

So sorry to hear this. Has the vet made an incision in the abscess to try and drain the pus off. It does smell awful I know. It is important to try and clear some of the pus. I went in today as I sometimes find it difficult to do it on my own and the vet told me to bring him in as it is so important to keep it up as he is doing so well. Apart from the injections, is the vet doing anything with the abscesses, have they mentioned surgery and taken xrays. I am just surprised as the penicilin has worked wonders with mine.

 

[JBun]

If the penicillin isn't proving effective against the infection, your vet may need to either add an additional antibiotic or change to a different one. Chloramphenicol and azithromycin are both effective antibiotics that might work, but the azithromycin can cause GI problems for some rabbits, so should be used with some caution.

Treating abscesses with antibiotics can be a very long process and can take many weeks to months. They need to be continued as long as there are signs of infection, and for a little while beyond the last signs. With signs of worsening and it affecting her mobility, it would be best to get her into the vet tomorrow if you can. Also getting a pain reliever like metacam, will probably be helpful.

With the abscess having opened up, you will want to talk to your vet about cleaning it out each day. Usually you need to clean out the pus and irrigate with a proper antiseptic solution. Some vets will also have you apply medical grade manuka honey to the wound. But the wound needs to be kept open and cleaned out several times a day.
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Skin_diseases/Bacterial/Absc_treat/abscess_treat.htm (GRAPHIC PHOTOS)

Having the abscess surgically removed is also an option, and usually the best one to do if at all possible.

Sometimes the antibiotic can affect their appetite, though pain from the infection could also be causing loss of appetite. Giving metacam will help if it is due to pain, and you can also try adding some Benebac probiotics to help combat the effects of the antibiotic.

 

[Chrisdoc]

Jenny well said. We started with antibiotics but switched to Penicilin as we were seeing no change. Bandy is still on a small dose of metacam daily mixed with a stomach protector and he luckily has been eating all the way through. It is so important to drain and clean daily and I have been amazed how much this has changed it and how much it has shrunk. Do discuss options with them.

I hope you can find something that works for your bun.

 

[houserabbitz]

If the penicillin isn't proving effective against the infection, your vet may need to either add an additional antibiotic or change to a different one. Chloramphenicol and azithromycin are both effective antibiotics that might work, but the azithromycin can cause GI problems for some rabbits, so should be used with some caution.

Treating abscesses with antibiotics can be a very long process and can take many weeks to months. They need to be continued as long as there are signs of infection, and for a little while beyond the last signs. With signs of worsening and it affecting her mobility, it would be best to get her into the vet tomorrow if you can. Also getting a pain reliever like metacam, will probably be helpful.

With the abscess having opened up, you will want to talk to your vet about cleaning it out each day. Usually you need to clean out the pus and irrigate with a proper antiseptic solution. Some vets will also have you apply medical grade manuka honey to the wound. But the wound needs to be kept open and cleaned out several times a day.
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Skin_diseases/Bacterial/Absc_treat/abscess_treat.htm (GRAPHIC PHOTOS)

Having the abscess surgically removed is also an option, and usually the best one to do if at all possible.

Sometimes the antibiotic can affect their appetite, though pain from the infection could also be causing loss of appetite. Giving metacam will help if it is due to pain, and you can also try adding some Benebac probiotics to help combat the effects of the antibiotic.

Thank you! So, I have been using the warm compresses which she hates! I really can't tell if the abscess is “draining”. It's weepy, but it's a brownish liquid and it’s smelly. I always assumed pus would be white, but I really don't know what it is supposed to look like.

Basically my vet didn't want to do the surgery. She said because of the abscess' location and the age of my bunny, it's risky and she "will never get all the pus out". So, she opted for the penicillin, an injection a day, and Daphne is getting something for her stomach. She is eating and drinking, completely lucid and not grouchy (except when I have a compress on her). This morning, she scuttled out of her pen, still not totally weight bearing on the right hind, but it seemed a little better. I have refilled her RX, now going on 20+ days. I think I will continue with the compresses about 3 times a day, and the meds. If her leg is still draggy or gets worse, I'll bring her back to the vet. To answer Chrisdoc's question (thank you also for your input), the abscess has never been lanced or opened by my vet. We're trying to get it to open non-surgcally. That's why I find this so confusing. My vet said it will open, but a lot of the research I've done said it won't on its own. Ugh!

 

[Chrisdoc]

Normally it needs a little help. The vet can make a small incision to be able to drain the abscess which does not require anaesthetic. The pus is like an off white colour and smells like very rancid blue cheese. It has a toothpaste consistency at its thickest but as it improves, it will get thinner and be watery and pink at times. My vet is packing the abscess every time it is drained with natural honey, manuka is best but I can't get it readily over her and it is so expensive so I am using ecological natural honey which breaks down the pus. Bandy has penicilin injections only every 72 hours but I am treating the abscess 3 or 4 times a day and it has noticeably improved over the last week. They can be surgically cleaned under anaesthetic, abscess is cut open and cleaned and can be packed with antibiotic beads. However, in some cases, it cannot all be removed if bone is compromised but it will assist in recovery. There is no miracle cure but I have tried to discuss options at every stage with my vet and have read loads on different kinds of treatments but relying on my vets experience as well.

I hope your bun starts to respond, they are very stressful for them and for us.

 

[houserabbitz]

I'll keep up with the compresses and meds. If there's no improvement with this cycle of meds, I'll get a second opinion.

 

[houserabbitz]

I saw another vet on Saturday, this one was much better, and actually took a lot of time with Daphne. She said Daphne needs surgery, and today her bloodwork came back clear, so I am going to do it. She said she will remove them (she actually has three abscesses, only one has been trying to come to a head) and hopefully they won't come back. She said Daphne is actually pretty stable and she will be fine until it's scheduled. Wish us luck.

 

[Chrisdoc]

Hope Daphne does Ok, do keep us updated, I will be thinkig of her

 

[houserabbitz]

I created a crowd sourcing page for Daphne, it okay for me to post a link in this thread? Mods?