Posts From NTLoser re: Jasper Not Eating or Pooping

[Pipp]

ntloser wrote:

Hi,

UGH what an bad time for the board to disappear. Thank goodness for the temp board. 3 days ago Thursday, we moved the buns to the patio thinking maybe they would like to feel the sun and get some fresh air.

We noticed Jasper did not like it at first but then started to relax. Then we noticed soft poops.. but not like the special poop.

We moved them back in and everything seemed fine. That night we gave them some pellets and Jasper nibbled on some. The next morning, Friday, Jasper seemed like he was having a heat issue.. he was breathing really fast and not responding to things like he usually does. We thought he may have been running around his cage.. but after an hour or so things did not change.

We took him and Madison to the vet together an the vet checked Jasper and said he was in pain and had gas. They wanted $1200 too keep him there and do xrays etc etc. No problem can I give you some now.. Sure $800 deposit. Anyway.. we worked it out to where they would give jasper some fluids and check him then we could continue tratment at home and still pay rent and buy food this coming month.. it was the only thing that we could afford since they did not want to take any sort of payment and I did not qualify for their pet credit program. So we left and let them help Jasper then went back and picked Jasper up later that day.

Jasper seemed to be doing much better. It was good we were able to do
his meds and force feed that evening. And I noticed he was munching on some Kale and possibly going potty.

Next day Saturday Jasper seems good and is munching here and there. We do all his meds and have trouble force feeding him. We had seen him snacking on and off so figured he was full. But we still tried to feed him.

At midnight we noticed he was doing his heat exhaustion thing.. he seemed to be acting like he was before we brought him in.. maybe not quite as bad. We called the animal tech and she is going to be at the office at 8am and we are going to bring Jasper back in.

I have been waiting up.. I don't think I can sleep. I do notice he is grooming himself and I caught him munching on some Kale and then he went in the potty box.. not sure if he went though.

I am going to get a new cage and separate to make sure i can examine the potty. Its just that he was acting so normal Sat morning and we saw him eating and sitting in the potty box we thought it was over with and well did not watch his every move or bother to get a separate cage .. Geez what a mistake that was.. I saw jasper nibblig on some kale just a few minutes ago.. phew...

I am thinking because he is eating and grooming that is good right? The vet did not end up taking any xrays or anything.. ..The worse part is both bunnys are mad at us they don't understand what is going on now we are always picking them up and forcing food or taking them on car rides..

Just 2 more hours and I can start getting ready...

Pipp wrote:

He doesn't sound that sick, but gas and stasis can be symptoms of other things so you do have to try and figure out the problem

But if he's eating a little and pooping a little, he's not in stasis.

What meds do you have?

He could be reacting to stress, so stay calm.

He could have gotten his system out of whack and it takes a few days to get back on track. I wouldn't force feed him if he's eating just a little on his own at this stage. That's further stress. As long as he's eating a pooping a little, stasis isn't an issue, it's just something you have to watch to prevent.

Overheating symptoms include a high temperature and often wet muzzle, did he have that when he was outside? Did the vet take his temperature?

Panting could be an overheating symptom, but also just a symptom of pain/discomfort.

The fluids may have helped, but it could have also been the car ride breaking up the gas bubble.

Simethicone, tummy rubs and a little exercise help if it's gas.

You definitely have to check his poops to get a better idea of his immediate health.

Hope he's okay! Let us know how it goes!

sas

ntloser wrote:

Hi,

Yes his temp was fine. I have never seen Jasper over heat before and I only describe it that way because of symptoms I read on line. Its like he appears to be shaking but I think its because he is breathing fast and not really shaking.. He is not doing it now

Simethicone Infant Anti-gas drops 3 times a day.
Baytril Supension 2 times a day
Reglan Syrup 3 times
Cisapride Suspension 3 times a day
Metaca Syrup once daily.. the bottle says twice but the print out sheet says one .

It is so bitter sweet Madison tries to stop us from getting to Jasper .. they do not understand we are trying to help .. and they are mad at us

I have been watching all night and he seems fine (now).. I wonder if he does the heavy breathing shake thing when his pain meds wear off and he is trying to deal with the tummy ache. We stretched the med day into 18 hours to try to make it less often hoping that would also make it less traumatic.. so maybe it was too long between doses, his pain meds wore off, and he was doing his shake
... I am gonna go to the 24 hour walmart and get something to build a 2nd cage to separate them to double check the potty. I am wondering if I should drive them all the way to the vet.. if it will only stress them out..


You know, when I was at the vets they did not want both of them together because it would be too hard to monitor the poops.. and that kind of made me mad.. I was thinking you need to sit there and f-ing watch because splitting them up will only cause more stress.. but now I see.. it is hard to tell I see him appear to go but I cant tell if it is his or madisons.. Madisons poops have been smaller lately too.. geez I had no idea taking them out on the patio was going to do this.. It was supposed to be a fun day for them.. you know I saw videos of bunny jumping off the diving board into a family pool.. with all kinds of people around.. they did not seem stressed out..But.. I am so worried . I mean it seems to easy to get them off track...

ntloser wrote:

Would the bunny go in the potty box and act like he was going if he wasnt? I ask cause he went in there again and you know.. did the back up thing and appears to be going.. It is so good to see him acting normal.. I just checked but it is hard to tell I think yes though.. and grooming too that is a good sign right?

naturestee1 wrote:

No xrays? And they're giving gut motility drugs???

Hopefully the GI issues are just from stress and no blockage has formed (often forms after gut slowdown, not before).

Other than those notes, I agree with everything Pipp said. I could have sworn I had a copy of the GI stasis article I wrote but now I can't find it. You can also try offering canned pumpkin. Do wet his greens down before feeding them and make sure he's getting lots of fluids. That's more important than syringe feeding him. Pedialyte is a good choice and some rabbits will drink the flavored stuff willingly.

tonyshuman wrote:

I might try a different veggie if I were you. Kale is delicious and bunnies love it, but it can cause gas in some bunnies. Perhaps something like parlsey, romaine, or dandelion greens might be better. It is good to keep the two together, although it is difficult to tell the poos apart. They can get very upset from being separated. Also, make sure they are still eating as much hay as before. It's possible that there's something wrong with the hay and that's why things are going strange.

ntloser wrote:

Hi,

Jasper seemed to be doing really well today eating more and pooping. The vet tech stressed force feeding was so important. But Jasper just was NOT having any. She offered to take Jasper over night and feed and give his meds and have the vet examine him the next day (tomorrow) Mon.

As much as I didnt want to disturb or stress him or Madison .. I thought having another vet visit and care from a professional would be good. And since it was covered under what we already paid I figured they really wanted to do it because it was needed and not because they were trying to get more money. When we brought in Jasper he had lost 90 grams.. but the tech noticed an improvement too.

I am going to switch to Romaine too and some of the veggies you mentioned.. I dug out he spare boxes of cage panels and got a 6x9 sheet of linoleum.. And decided to build them a new super huge cage...

Do you think blockage is happening if he is pooping?

 

[Maureen Las]

I can understand why you would want the tech to help out with him because it sounds like you haven't been through this kind of thing a lot with him.
I guess that there are a few things that don't seem to set well with me that I read previously and I'll just pass them on.

As (naturestee Angela) mentioned it is highly unusual for a vet to prescribe motility drugs for a rabbit without doing an x-ray to determine if there is a blockage. If he is pooping normally right now most likely he doesn't have a blockage but many of the members here feel that reglan and cisapride are too harsh and potentially dangerous anywayfor a rabbit.If the vet did not do an x-ray there is a cause to wonder about the vet.The tech is telling you to keep feeding him and I agree that if he is not eating on his own that he at, some point, may need force feeding. Have you tried to find food (greens or maybe pure canned pumpkin ) that he really likes to try to entice him to eat on his own.

I believe that he is on simethicone, cisapride, reglan and I cannot remembr if you are giving sub q fluids . if not he should be getting pedialyte per syringe..if he doesn't like unflavored you can give the flavored. ( or serve it in a bowl)

Iforce fed Beau a couple times several mornings ago ( after the dental) as I felt his GI system was shutting down..and it did seem to 'jumpstart" his GI tract into the 'ON" mode as he didn't need it by afternoon and seemed to eat on his own.

I am just introducing the idea that possibly the vet and vet tech are overtreating him rather than undertreating him which in many ways can be just as harmful.

In terms of force feeding ..

if he is eating on his own no need to force feed him and upset his system and stress him out

as Randy always stresses "fluids are most important"

I am wondering if this vet is trying to make $ off you

Jasper doesn't sound severely ill to me.

I didnot read all of the previous post tonight but I know that pipp questioned whethr he was really in stasis.

his inital behavior sounded like gas to me and I would have given simethicone,a lot of fluids per syringe, pedialyte mixed with pineapple juice , maybe some bene-bac , a lot of greens and anything else i could think of that was healthy (pumpkin)
but i wouldn't push 30 cc of CC down him 3 times a day (as I have been told to do on occassion)

Maureen

 

[tonyshuman]

angieluv had some VERY good points. Also, if he is pooping it can't be a total blockage, and you wouldn't want to give motility drugs for only a partial blockage.

 

[naturestee]

How is Jasper doing?

 

[ntloser]

Hi Everybody,

Jasper is doing well!!! . Angieluv.. I completely agree with you.
I am just glad everything worked out. Doctors (vets), and Mechanics.. I do not like dealing with them.

 

[Maureen Las]

Glad to hear this

but mechanics, contractors and salesmenare more difficult than vets :biggrin2: