possible head tilt, advice needed

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bellaterra214

Bellaterra214
Joined
Feb 19, 2013
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Location
Buena Park, CA
This morning, I woke up to find my new baby bunny acting very weird. Lulu's eyes are twitching back and forth and she is leaning to the right. We she tries to move she is very unbalanced and tips over. I can't get her to eat anything, but I have been syringing a little bit of water every couple of hours. I have her detained in a box with towel until we can get her to the vet 4:45pm pst. she tucked in and sleeping right now. It's been a very stressful morning and I'm worried about our newest addition.

Is there anything I can do until I can get her to the vet? Is she in pain? It looks like head tilt, but it worries me because she is so small. 4-5 months and still about a pound. should i get some baby food? how much would i need to feed her? so many questions and the vet is still 3 hours away......aarrrrgggghhhh **cry**

I have written down fenbendazole and ivomec to take with me to the vet. any advice would be greatly appreciated.

thank you
 
I've never been in this situation but I wanted to wish you both all the best.
 
How long has it been since she's eaten? The threshold where not eating becomes a medical emergency is 8-12+ hours. If you'll hit that threshold before the vet appointment, then it's probably a good idea to syringe feed her a bit of either fruit or veggie flavored, preservative free baby food or a pellet slurry.

If you are already at or past that mark and the the vet is why the visit isn't until 4:45 (as opposed to having to wait for a ride or to get off of work or whatever - ie a circumstance that can't be changed), call the vet back and stress that it's truly an emergency - be sure to mention the approximate length of time she's gone without eating AND the severity of her other symptoms. Do what you can to talk them into letting you bring her in sooner. If you're feeling ballsy enough, it wouldn't be inappropriate to show up early as a "walk in" whether you're told she can be seen earlier or not to see if the vet could at least get started with her in between other appointments. Any decent vet will put an emergency situation first, even if it means making regular appointments wait. Heck, Norman's post-adoption vet check last week was delayed 15 minutes or so due to an emergency with another animal. If waiting until 4:45 is simply your only option, then it's probably a good idea to try to get a little bit of something in her stomach (maybe a couple ccs).

As for pain, if you have metacam at home, you could give that. For a 1 lb rabbit, 8 mg would be an appropriate dose; how much liquid medication that equates to depends on the concentration it was mixed to. The reason I see no harm in giving metacam is primarily that if you don't give it to her, the vet is going to anyway - prescribing metacam is practically a given when stasis is involved [be SURE to tell them exactly how much you gave and when you gave it if you do dose her with metacam].

If you don't have metacam, there are two over the counter options - baby ibuprofen and low dose or baby aspirin. Neither is as safe as metacam (and possibly not as effective, either) and both would interfere with the vet's ability to promptly get her onto metacam. Given that she's comfortable enough to sleep and the vet visit is less than 3h away, I would NOT give her anything other than metacam for pain - at this point, it's better to give nothing than to give ibuprofen or aspirin.

I can't help you with the head tilt - you know about as much about it as I do (and probably more), heh. JBun or another member will probably be along very soon to help, though.

:pray:
 
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If your bun is used to veggies, try some of those. Rabbits will often eat their veggies still, even when they won't eat their other food. But I agree with Jennifer. If it's been 12 or more hours since your bun last ate, try and get the appointment moved up.

Make sure the vet checks for both an ear infection as the cause, and e. cuniculi. I would be more inclined to think EC because of the weight gain problems, as that is another symptom of EC. Typically the medications given for head tilt are Panacur(fenbendazole), metacam to control pain and inflammation, and an antibiotic(usually baytril) to cover the possibility of an infection. Meclizine is also sometimes used to help with the dizziness. Some vets will give steroid shots, but steroids are considered very risky as they lower a rabbits immune system. Really I would only consider it in very severe cases as a last resort. Metacam seems to be a better and safer anti inflammatory med. If a rabbit is experiencing a GI slowdown, a gut stimulant may also be needed, and also a recovery food like Critical Care food mix, may be needed for times when syringe feeding is necessary.

Ivomec(ivermectin) isn't used for cases of e. cuniculi.

http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/Otit/otitis.htm
http://www.bio.miami.edu/hare/tilt.html
http://www.woodward-vets.co.uk/information/Encephalitozoon%20cuniculi.pdf
 
I will not be able to get the the vet because of transportation issues and apologetically this was the earliest I would be able to go in.

I didn't have any Metacam on hand, but I did have something else. This morning I gave her .03ml Torbugesic 1.7mg/ml and she ate just a little bit of alpha alpha just now! yay! not as much as i would like, but i'll take anything at this point.

keeping her warm and calm for another.......2 hrs. and then a 10 min trip to the vet. time has never passed so slowly
 
If you weren't directed by your vet to give the torbugesic, and especially if it wasn't prescribed for this bun, to be safe you should call up the vet office and mention giving it, and the weight of your bun and exact dosage that you gave, if you haven't already done so. A strong opiate like torbugesic should only be given under a vets direction. And just keep a close eye on your bun for any negative reactions to it.

Best of luck at the vets, and I hope your little bun starts feeling better soon.
 
thanks for the advice. the torbugesic was prescribed to Bino a little over a month ago when I accidentally stepped on him. The vet said because of liability issues, they would not be able to give me actual medication doses over the phone without seeing the rabbit. I gave her the meds early this morning around 930 am and she seems to be doing ok considering the circumstances.

Going to take the bottle and noted how much and when I gave her the Torbugesic to make sure the vet is aware. 1 hour to go
 
she just ate 4 pellets. YAY!

yes, of course i'm counting!!

20 mins to vet. i can stop grinding my teeth. my jaw hurts. stress sucks.
 
I will not be able to get the the vet because of transportation issues and apologetically this was the earliest I would be able to go in.

I suspected that might be the case :(. Bad problems always seem to travel with additional complications... an unfortunate fact of life. Since you know getting her to the vet sooner is impossible, focus on keeping her comfortable and reassuring her that you're doing all you can to get her some help. Do your best not to feel bad about having to wait for a vet visit. Sometimes doing what you know would be ideal simply isn't possible through no fault of your own, and dwelling on what you can't change won't do anything but add more stress when you need it the least. Besides, pets are often aware enough of compassion to realize that you're trying even if your efforts haven't made them feel better yet. Perhaps it's an ability to sense when tension/anxiety/concern are focused specifically around them? All I know is that they know when you're trying and whether they show it or not, they appreciate that a great deal.

I really hope the vet's prognosis is good and she's able to start feeling better! You and your poor bunnies have certainly had more than your fair share of misfortune - you're well overdue for things to finally start going smoothly ><
 
Lulu is looking much better today. Her eyes are no longer twitching, but her balance is still a little off. Every time she goes to periscope she flops over, but she's able to hop across the floor without staggering or falling over. whew~~ I know we are not out of the woods, but I am feeling hopeful.

Last time I visited the vet, they had to sell me a whole bottle of the Orbax Oral Suspension. I brought the bottle and syringe I had at home. He was not able to see an infection in her ears. He did this other test where he turned off the light and used his light thing going left to right in her eyes. I'm assuming it has something to do with pupil response.

He said it was definitely the beginnings of head tilt. He gave her a shot of Ivomec to cover the parasite aspect of it and prescribed .05/ml of the Orbax once a day for at least an indefinite amount of time for know. I have another appoint if 5 days for a follow-up status check. He wants to me come in immediately if she she started to show any signs of regression.

She's much chubbier than she looks. That brings a goofy smile to my face. 2.4lbs! I also got a bottle of Nutri-cal until she starts eating regularly again. Last night I just stuck her paw into the nutri-cal and she cleaned it off. She did try to flick as much of it off, but she got a good pea size. Surprisingly after that, I offered her a dandelion leaf and she gladly scarfed that down. YAY! only a single leaf, but it was a start. I found out last night there was a herbivore version called Critical Care. Anything having to do with the syringe seems to stress her out, but now I know about the fiber difference.

Woke up every 2 hours to check on her and bribe her with food. Noticed a little bit of diarrhea, but they are slower gaining some consistency. Got her to eat 2 more dandelion leaves and the water in her bowl went down considerably over the night. She ate half the pellets that were in her bowl. Another yay!!

She's much more playful today, but tires easily. She hanging out with me in the bedroom today and is enjoying running around on the bed and sleeping against the pillows. Keeping a very close eye on her today and hoping for the best. She's eating some alpha alpha as we speak.

I'm sitting in the bedroom and cheering over poo....that will probably me all day today. Wow~really? ......yeah, i'm gonna cheer over poo today and i'm proud of it.

Thank you for your wishes and I will keep you updated.
 
I know they have acidophilus supplement for small animals, but I would like to go another route and wanted to ask your opinions on the following product.

What is Bio-K+®?
Bio-K+® is a unique probiotic - the only product with the patented formula of L. acidophilus CL1285® and L. casei LBC80R® .This exclusive formula contains beneficial bacteria that can be consumed and remain active in great numbers in the intestine to promote and maintain a healthy, balanced digestive system. Probiotics must survive the effects of stomach acids and bile salts in great numbers to be effective. The quantity of friendly bacteria per dose is crucial for positive results. The optimal dosing of the live bacteria in the formula ensures that the maximum benefit will be conferred, and once taken, Bio-K+® is fast-acting. Bio-K+® is suitable for all ages: children (12 months and up), adult, and seniors.

Here's the website

http://www.biokplus.com/en-us/about-probiotics/probiotics-faq#t19n3584

I use this when I am taking antibiotics and was wondering if it would be ok to give it to Lulu to help her gut out. How much would you guys recommend I give her? I would rather not giver her anything full of sugar considering the Nutri-cal I am also providing. Any other suggestions would also be very helpful.

I read an article were someone made a blackberry purree with timonthy hay cut to 1mm to help gut out.
 
I would call the vet and see if this is ok to give with the condition she is in and the other meds that she is on. You don't want to do anything that might interfere with the progress... I hope everything works out.. Please keep us posted...
you are in my thoughts..

Vanessa
 
Is what you have one of the dairy-free formulas? Rabbits are lactose intolerant, so if it's not a dairy-free formula, I definitely wouldn't give it. Also, do you have a full ingredients list you could give us?

It's pretty difficult to overdose with probiotics - underdosing is a bigger concern. That said, BeneBac Plus has 20M+ bacteria per gram, with 1g being the dose for rabbits up to 10 lbs; the stuff you linked comes in capsules with 30-50 billion, so it would take *very* little to get an adequate dosage into her but at the same time, a little extra shouldn't hurt as long as it's safe to give her the product in the first place. Without knowing which formula you've got and the exact ingredients for it, though, I'm not comfortable wagering a guess one way or the other.

I second lovelops' suggestion about calling the vet and confirming it with them - I see no reason why probiotics would interfere with any other meds, but I'd trust a vet's opinion over my own regarding whether or not the product is safe to give at all and how *much* it's safe to give if it is.

Anyway, I'm glad she's improving a bit - sounds like you caught things early and she's got a good chance of making a full recovery!

True diarrhea, which is very watery, is a medical emergency. You said "a little diarrhea" though, which makes me think it's loose stools rather than actual diarrhea. This site shows the difference: http://imgur.com/a/5N4lD

If it's loose stools, I'm inclined to blame the Nutri-cal, which I honestly don't think is safe for rabbits. It's nearly 30% fat and it appears to be designed for cats/dogs (unless there's another formula I don't know about?) which means it probably contains things rabbits aren't able to digest, seeing as they're vegans.

I would stop the Nutri-cal ASAP. Get some Critical Care if you can (apple-banana flavor - bunnies tend to hate the anise, though my vet says it's popular with guinea pigs). If you can't, then feeding a pellet slurry would be far better than Nutri-cal. The difference between Critical Care and powdered pellets is basically just that the Critical Care has extra nutrients added to it. It's definitely better if you can get your hands on it, but pellet slurry is a perfectly viable substitute if you can't.

Pellet slurry is easiest to make if you have a coffee bean grinder, mortar and pestle or perhaps a food processor that you could break the pellets up with first... however, if you don't, that's ok. Grind them up if you can, then put the pellets (or ground-up pellets) in a bowl; add enough water to cover them + a little extra and microwave them until the water boils. Leave the bowl sitting on the counter for 10 minutes or so, to give the pellets time to absorb the water. Break them up/mix it together as best as you can. If you don't have a grinder, you'll definitely need to cut the tip off of a syringe and widen the hole a bit before syringe-feeding the slurry so that it can get through the syringe.

As for the blackberry puree, you wouldn't want to give too much fruit since it's so sugary, but you could add a little bit of puree'd fruit (or fruit-flavored, preservative free baby food) to the slurry after you made it and you could also include ground-up hay in the slurry if you had a grinder.
 
I totally forgot about the dairy aspect. Luckily that have a non-dairy version

Fermented Soy Probiotic

Ingredients

Water
Evaporated cane juice
Soy protein isolate
Active cultures of L. acidophilus + L. casei
Nutritional yeast
Natural flavours
Pectin

NUTRITION FACTS (PER 3.5OZ.)

Calories 50
Fat 0g 0%
Cholesterol 0mg 0%
Sodium 40mg 2%
Total Carbohydrate 9g 3%
Protein 3 g
Calcium 0%

Anything I need to be worried about?

After looking at the pictures its not true diarrhea, mushy poo is more like it. its getting better and better every time she uses the litter box. she's not eating as robustly as before, but it's slowly increasing.

Those aspects of Nutri-Cal did bother me, and I wish I had know about the Critical Care, but the vet was comfortable with me giving Lulu Nutri-Cal. It did give her an appetite with I liked, but I can imagine if I were a vegetarian I wouldn't have liked the ingredients either. So far she's eating so I have only given her a pea sized amount. If her condition worsens, then I am definitely going to go with the pellet slurry.

thank you everyone for your advice and wishes.
 
I'm glad you got your bun to the vet ok and that she's feeling better.

So, did the vet think the head tilt was due to e. cuniculi then? If so, were you not given any Panacur(fenbendazole) or metacam for it? Did the vet mention what the Ivomec was for?

I'm a bit surprised about a vet suggesting the nutri cal instead of critical care, which is actually formulated to be given to herbivores. Do you know if this vet is a very experienced rabbit vet? I know nutri cal used to be used quite often, but critical care is a much better alternative now for supplementing a rabbit that isn't eating. I would definitely get some critical care or use the pellet mush, unless she is eating enough on her own. Nutrical isn't going to be providing the necessary nutrients and fiber, plus could continue to disrupt your rabbits GI flora and worsen the mushy poop.

In any case, I'm really glad she's showing so much improvement.
 
My boyfriend made a comment to me last night that has been really bothering me.

He reminded me of something I had said a few times last week that I didn't even remember I said until he brought it up.

Last week, I had made a comment that Lulu's eyes were looking super crossed eyed. When she gets alarmed or scared, and her eyes get really big, they kind of look crossed eyed. But last week, I did make that comment on 3 different occasions. Could this have been an early sign I missed? I know I did everything possible, but I would like to know just in case this happens again. Information is knowledge, right?

thanks. any thought would be appreciated.

p.s. Lulu's doing good today and eating more than she did yesterday. She is till tiring easily, but she has improved from yesterday. Yay!
 
Lulu is our latest addition and we have only had her for about 45 days. So this our first incident with this this little one.
 
Oh~ the incident about 2 months ago? I accidentally stepped on my other rabbit Bino about 2 months ago, but he is back is his old self.
 

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