Possible EC? Dosing for Panacure?

[Moocow]

I'm sorry i this is the wrong area! I have a six year old Himalayan that'd I'd like to dose with a round of panacure to make sure he's parasite free, but the problem is I can't figure out how much to does him with. He's had some trouble with hind end paresis and the only real rabbit savvy vet in my area just keeps telling me he probably just hurt himself and the scar tissue is causing the weakness in his hind. Although after many people suggested I treat for EC just to be certain it's not that since X-rays showed no signs of injury and he has full feeling in his toes. I figure it can't hurt to try a treatment with panacure esp since he's in extremely good health otherwise. I just want to try everything possible before just settling with the fact that he may have this problem for the remainder of his life. The vet wouldn't even discuss the possibilty of EC and said "he hasn't seen it in years" in a rabbit, he seems quite full of himself and according to my research it can be transfered through infected hay, grass, and form mother to kit via placental fluid. So I need help on dosing! The 1 syringe graduation it comes with is for a 5lb rabbit and Moose weighs a petite 1.45lbs. He was the runt and is a healthy and stable weight but no vets in my area will advise dosing without payment (please I'm not paying 77 dollars for dosing instructions when I've just paid for five rounds of laser therapy) so I'm basically on my own. If anyone could help me out with dosing I'd really appreciate it! Moose thanks you in advance as well!

http://www.noahcompendium.co.uk/MSD_Animal_Health/Panacur_Rabbit__18_75_ACU-_Oral_Paste/-42086.html
For the dosing info to work off of.

 

[Watermelons]

Fenbendazole should be dosed at 20-50mg/kg on a full tummy in Rabbits... I dont see anything wrong with the info you have on that link. But the type of medication was chosen poorly. Pastes while usually easily taken by the rabbit are horrible for dosing. You would have been better with powder or liquid. You will have to figure out how to divide up 1 "graduation" based on your bunnys weight. Not to mention medication is usually pooly divided up in pastes which is why their best used for large breed animals since those animals usually get the entire tube.


If you suspect its EC that dose would be daily for at least 1 month. Other then the hind end issues what is your basis for thinking its EC? What other EC symptoms is your rabbit showing? As you said, hes in really good health. Hind end injuries can be very common in rabbits. From everything you said in your post, this doesnt sound very EC-ish at all.

 

[Moocow]

^I havent bought the meds yet! If you could point me towards a better online source to buy from that'd be fantastic. I'm familiar with using syringes since I give him his madacam orally everyday already, so something mixable would be much better. I guess it screams EC to me based on stories I've heard from people I've spoken to, and the fact that it was fairly gradual when we thought of a slight limp must be a injury although he showed no signs of pain and no change in eating or behavior, and its slowly worsening despite treatment. He's also had extensive outdoor contact eating grass and such and we do have wild rabbits and other things in the area.


I bit more info about his paresis and possible EC infection. When he walks a normal slow and careful gait can be maintained sometimes; turning is difficult and is he starts to move quickly I've noticed one side of his hind end will list and then his back end will collapse; he normally rights himself but sometimes needs help. Because of this I try not to let him walk for more than a few minutes because I'm worried if it's some kind of spinal nerve injury that it's only worsening things. He had undergone five laser treatments since December with no improvement and has been on medicam consistently for a while now (since his limp appeared) which does help a bit but not much. His hind end weakness is mild to severe depending on the day. He can get around his cage okay and we've given him a tiny cat bed which he loves to lay in, we've also got a soft mat for the area near his food bowls and hay since he sits there often. It's just frustrating since he's gotten a bit worse since December and although the vet keeps saying its just scar tissue he has nothing to back up his claims and couldn't even remember the name of E. cuniculi.



These are from early december, on a good day. (I was teaching him to spin on command) It's a bit worse now but I could grab a new video soon if needed.

His current cage set up, he had a larger cage which broke several months ago while I was away at college and this was all we could afford. Normally its not a problem since he gets to run around out of his cage a lot but now that he has the paresis in his hind end I worry about letting him run, especially on bad days when he has a lot of trouble just walking. He doesn't seem to be in pain and even tries to binky but never sticks the landing. Also in this picture note his hind end which is kind of smushed at a odd angle beneath him. He doesn't have trouble getting in and out of his litter box but has gotten a bit more lazy with using it, with all accidents outside his box occurring at night.

How he sits with his legs spread wide in order to keep himself balanced since his feet tend to go inward and then he'll fall to one side or another.

example of weakness from december one a good day. after this his back end wobbled and fell, he quickly righted himself.

I guess I'm just looking for opinions on the paresis and obviously the dosage help for the panacure. If I can scrape up the funds by may I'll take him to a different vet but for now I'm done dealing with my current one which was so highly acclaimed they were even featured on animal planet, but general rabbit breeders have been more helpful thus far than they have. I'm just worried since it's gotten a little bit worse since december but doesn't seem to have gotten worse in the past two months. If the panacure doesn't help I'll see about getting on antibiotics and if all else fails I'm going to build him a cart so he can romp around outside his cage happily.

 

[Moocow]

His limp started last july and I took him to the vet on the 22nd of july. So his initial injury (if it was that) has presented itself worse now? Idk it just doesn't add up to me. He was on medacam from july to august and then not again until december. Also why would it first present itself as a lower leg limp on his right side and then progress to include both sides? I mean it wasn't like one day I woke up to find him injured, me and the vet just assumed limp=injury, but since xrays were clean we figured he had bumped it or something and that it would heal when it has only gotten worse.

back in december, favoring left leg since it seems to have a tad more stability than the right, haven't checked recently to see if this is still true.

Another thing I've noticed is that he now holds his tail crooked, you can see it slighty in the first picture on the original post but now it leans towards that side even more.

 

[Watermelons]

Lets try and get some other oppinions on the matter first. It is still probably best to take your bun to a true bunny savvy vet and do some tests to figure out what is actually happening before you jump to any conclusions.
I have edited your topic title.

 

[Moocow]

Well there aren't many other tests for EC. I can't afford an MRI and testing for trites is unreliable since many rabbits have been exposed to the parasite. My vet is "rabbit savy" but unwilling to listen to me and I don't have money to waste on vets who aren't helping me.

 

[tonyshuman]

I think a vet that doesn't know what E cuniculi is isn't a bunny savvy vet. Is your vet on our list?
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=11620&forum_id=9

I would try the fenbendazole. You can buy it at feed stores, like tractor supply, if there are any of those nearby. I don't know if you can get it online. Fenbendazole is not the best antiparasitic to treat E cuniculi, however, because it doesn't get into the brain well. A more recent drug of a similar type that does get into the brain is Marquis (ponazuril) and it was originally developed for horses.

Here's some helpful info about EC, in case you haven't found it yet:
http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/Neurology_main.htm

I can't say whether it looks like an old or new injury or if it is EC. If he's already on metacam daily (why?) the pain from a slight injury, old or new, shouldn't be causing him to walk funny like that.

 

[Moocow]

Yup my vet is on the list. He new what EC was but couldn't remember it exasct name until I told him. The vet suggested we keep him on medacam because if inflammation of the tissue around the spinal cord is the problem than hypothetically reducing the inflammation should put less pressure on the nerves allowing him better control. I found panacur pnline in liquid form for goats could I use that? Ill look into the newer drug but fro. What I read it is expensive, only available via vet perpscription, and must be dilluted to treat rabbits. I've read every link I could find online so I've already seen that one but thank you both for your help this far.

 

[Moocow]

Any help?please?

 

[ZRabbits]

Truly wish I could help, but don't know about the medication you said was for goats. Unfortunately lots of medication is being taken off shelves and we are made to get a prescription from the Vet.

So sorry to hear about your bunny. Hoping someone on here with more knowledge will help.

K

 

[majorv]

I may have missed it in your posts, but did your vet doa blood titer on him? A blood titerfor the antibodies can be done and then would be repeateda few weeks or month later to compare the results. If the count is going up then it would indicate an active infection ofEC. I know that Himalayans, with their long body, are more suspectibleto back injury...but if you've eliminated any bone or nerve injury then that wouldn't be the problem.

You really need a vet who is moreknowledgeable. We had to do a lot of reading on our own when one of our rabbits got sudden hind limb paresis. I can't help with the treatment or dosing.Our rabbit's condition went downhill before we could do much.In our case, we figured out that she got it from her mother.

 

[Moocow]

^the vet refuses to test or treat for EC since he doesn't think it is a possibility since he "hasn't seen an EC infection in years". I don't have the money atm to get a second opinion or have any more tests done. And I don't want to go to another vet to have them tell me they wont see if it's EC, I don't have money/time to waste on a vet who isn't willing to try things.

As far as liquid panacur all I can find is http://www.wammocks.com/Safe-Guard-Fenbendazole-Liquid-Panacur-Goat-Wormer-697600-B.htm which is just a non paste panacur so I'll most likely try that.

 

[ZRabbits]

Where in South Jersey are you? Go see Dr. Joe at Blackwood Animal Hospital.



856-227-8503

He thought Neville's head tilt was EC and he is willing to learn anything about bunnies.

They have a great staff there and will work regarding finances.



K

 

[Moocow]

^That's right near me, I'm in Washington Township. When I have the money I'll try and set up an appointment.

 

[Sweetie]

A vet that will not listen to you about your rabbit is not a good vet. My vet listens to me about my rabbits. A vet that is willing to listen and learn about rabbits is a good vet, also one that consults with other bunny vets is a good vet.