Naboo is very sick.

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rosetintedlenses

rosetintedlenses

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, Illinois, USA
Naboo, my 3 year old lop has been sick for the past 2 weeks, with diarrhea off and on. He's been to the vet twice, and both times, he's come away with sulfatrim to try and stop whatever's causing it. Well, today, he had it again, and he hadn't been eating much, so I took him to the vet. Dr. Drake took a look at him and noticed that his gums were pale, his tongue purple, and he was wincing whenever he would feel his stomach, so they did some x-rays. At first, he thought that it was an abscess or an upper respiratory infection, but there was a spot on the x-ray that worried him. There was no sign of an abscess or uri, but there was a light spot in his gi tract that he thought was either normal poop or an obstruction.

From there, they shaved his belly so that we could do an ultrasound, but he couldn't see anything on it, so he's decided to refer me to a specialist, hoping that we can figure out what's causing this. I'm calling tomorrow morning to see when I can get him in, and hopefully it's something that can be easily fixed. I'm at my wit's end when it comes to figuring out what's wrong with him, and my vet is too, since he flat out told me that he has no idea what's going on. I'm just glad that he was very honest in telling me that there's nothing more that he can do, instead of acting like he knew everything even though he didn't.
 
Poor little guy.:(

Have any blood tests been done? Also, when the sulfatrim was prescribed, were his fecals checked for parasites or unusual bacteria, or was it just a guess?

Do be sure to keep him hydrated. Offer wet greens, water flavored with a tiny bit of juice, Pedialyte, or syringe some water or Pedialyte into him. It's easy to become dehydrated with diarrhea.

And could you describe that? Did he have both diarrhea and normal-looking fecals (that would be a cecal problem)? How bad is it, and how sudden? Did the sulfa drugs seem to help at all? What is his diet? Have you given any Benebac? If not, I'd do so. It's a probiotic that can be quite helpful. You can get it at pet stores or in larger tubes from your vet.

FYI, GI blockages can occur because of something else slowing the intestines down and aren't necessarily the cause. So, even with the diarrhea, it could be secondary to the actual problem.

I hope we can get some help for the little guy, and some answers for you.:pray:
 
He decided to not do any blood tests, because he thought that they wouldn't show anything. We did do testing for parasites and bacteria, and that didn't show anything at all.

I think I may give him some pedialyte, since he absolutely loves to drink that, since he may be getting dehydrated.

His diarrhea seriously looked very runny, with no form whatsoever. It wasn't really watery, but it was kinda like cat poo. It was all over his cage a few days ago, and it happens very suddenly, like one minute he's going normally in his litter box, and then there's diarrhea all over the cage a couple of minutes later.

The drugs did not help at all, and he free feeds on hay with less than a quarter cup of pellets a day. He does get some greens, but not very often because I have trouble finding greens that look good (his favorite is parsley). He is on a probiotic, but I have to order the benebac (I just ended up getting some at the pet store for until the benebac arrives because I can't find it anywhere around here.)

I'm really hoping it's not a gi blockage, but rather normal fecals, but hopefully the new vet will be able to help him out. I really appreciate how supportive everyone is here :)
 
Do you know if they tested him for coccidia?
Even if they did.......... it sometimes takes 2-3 samples several weeks apart to see the eggs in the feces under a microscope( because of the lifecycle. )
The vet should have done a blood profile as you can tell alot about the body from it including whether there is likelihood of parasites.

I hope the little guy doesn't have anything serious.
It's good that he is sending you to someone more knowledgeable
 
I don't know if they tested for coccidia, I imagine they did, though. The first vet that I saw wasn't Naboo's normal vet, though, and she did not worry for a second when she saw him. Dr. Drake, on the other hand was pretty worried when he started examining him.

Hopefully the new vet will do more tests.
 
I agree with angieluv, it is great that you are going to see a specialist.

I'm trying to figure out from your posts if he is having normal fecals as well as the diarrhea?

Light spots in an x-ray could be a variety of things. If the rabbit is pooping then there is not a complete obstruction- good news.

It sounds like Naboo could benefit from some gas meds (ovol, simethicone etc) Formation of gas is almost always present with diahhrea and partial blockages. I agree that bene-bac or a similar probiotic would really help right now too.

Depending on how much he is eating and also if bad bacteria is suspected in the gut, you can give him some Cholestyramine (Questran) which binds to bad toxins and can prevent furtehr GI upset. This can be found at most vets and pharmacies. But you should clear with the vet first that this is a product that Naboo should have. It is safe, I have used it many times on rabbits but it may not be necessary with Naboo at this point.
 
No, Questran isn't sold over the counter. My vet told me that they could only get it from a hospital, and then it would be in a fairly large pail considering the amount a rabbit would need. It's why we didn't get it for Dora. Maybe some vet clinics use it enough to be able to buy it, but mine couldn't unless specially requested and the patient bought the whole package.

But that's for Clostridium toxins, and the vet should have been able to see Clostridium bacteria in the fecals.
 
Hi,

First, Sulfatrim will cause severe diarrhea. It has been linked to a condition known as Tyzzer's Disease which is an overgrowth of a bacteria called Clostridium. In reality, it causes something like food poisoning. I rarely would consider using this family of drugs in a rabbit. It's old school from a time when little was known about rabbits.

I am very concerned about the pale gums and purple tongue. Did this not register as a problem with your vet? Those presentations arerecognized in any species by anymedical professional. That would lead me to believe your rabbit's problem might be a lower respiratory infection or even CHF (Congestive Heart Failure). Treating lower respiratory infections is very difficult. If a LRI is found, one of the best drugs to use is Chloramphenicol as it is very good at getting to "walled off" infections. I would suspect some type of diuretic might be in order. Traditionally Lasix has been used but some vets are using ACE inhibitors these days. I have not had an LRIs in quite some time to I have not used the inhibitors.

Since Questran was mentioned....not many vets are aware of this drug. If I remember correctly, it is used for some human issues. In rabbits, it is used to bind toxins caused by GI issues. This is not a drug that is commonly available and has to be compounded by a pharmacist. The problem with using this drug is that it requires huge amounts of hydration. If the rabbit is already dehydrated.....or if there is a problem like CHF in which you should not add more fluids, it might not be the way to go. Metronidazole is an antibiotic with huge anti-inflammatory properties that is highly effective in severe GI issues.

I urge you to get to a rabbit savvy vet immediately and address the pale gums and purple tongue....those are never good signs and should be treated immediately. I suspect that is where the root cause of your rabbit's issues lie.

Randy
 
The vet was very worried about the pale gums and purple tongue, but we chalked it up to stress since they were both normal color earlier in the day and they also returned to their normal color within a few minutes of being at the vet. He was very stressed when I brought him in, but he calmed down considerably about 10 minutes into the appointment.

He has been taken off of the sulfatrim, since it did no good, and the vet that he normally goes to thought that it was entirely unnecessary for him to be on it. The vet that put him on it was not his normal vet.

We were considering a respiratory infection, but on the x-ray, his lungs looked completely clear and they also sound clear. He hasn't been having any problems with breathing or anything like that.

He had been having normal fecals, but sometimes he gets the diarrhea really suddenly, and then it goes away as quickly as it showed up. This is why his vet was particularly concerned, just because he gets it about once a week. He still drinks and eats when he has it, but it makes me uncomfortable knowing that he's having diarrhea without a known cause.

He has started to eat again, and he has drank a little bit, but I'm waiting to see if there are any new fecals in his litter box. I'm going to call the new vet tomorrow and hope that they can get him in as soon as possible.
 
Make sure he's well hydrated in this situation, with diarhea and possible obstruction hydration is very important.
 
Okay, good news! I just got back from the new vet, and he discovered that his cheek teeth are impacted, and he had spurs that were so big, he didn't know how he was still eating at all. I don't know why it never occurred to me to have his teeth checked, but I'm glad that he did. He had a spur that was so long that it split the side of his tongue pretty bad, so it's pretty sore.

We went ahead and put him under anesthesia so that we could get his teeth filed down, and to get some sub-q fluids as well, because he thought that his belly felt a little too rigid. He says that his gi movement is very good, but he was a little dehydrated, so hopefully the fluids help. He's on his normal diet again, with the addition of some new antibiotics and some critical care until he eats properly.

The "diarrhea" is really just cecals, in his opinion, and we think that he couldn't eat them because his mouth hurt so bad. If he doesn't start improving a lot by Monday, we're supposed to bring him back in, but I think that he's doing lots better already.

Thank you all for your advice and support, I'm keeping a close eye on him and I will let you know if anything happens.
 
I feel so bad for you and Naboo. My Patrick went through something similar with his teeth. He was in so much pain that I almost lost him one week after adopting Luna, his girlfriend. Thankfully, Naturestee helped me find a rabbit savvy vet who helpedPatrick so much with his teeth. Poor little guy had to learn how to eat all over again at the age of six. (lol)

The vet gave you antibiotic, but did you also get a pain killer like metacam to help him eat while his mouth heals? Just in case, also keep some bene-bac on had because the antibiotic can upset the flora in Naboo's GI track. The things we learn as we go through all of these experiences.... ;)

myheart


 
Ouch. Good thing this vet thought to look into his mouth!

I've heard of dental pain keeping rabbits from eating their cecals, so that does sound right to me.

Oh, and welcome to the molar spur club! :coolness:
 
Right now, Naboo's on Meloxicam (which may be Meticam) for pain and Trimethoprim as an antibiotic, I believe. He has started eating and grooming himself, and he also drank a little. I'm just glad that this vet did more than feel his jaw and look at his front teeth, because I was starting to get really frustrated with this!

He also has some probiotics, so I'll definitely keep him on those, since he's on antibiotics.
 
Phew I hope that's the case. Keep us updated...
edit: meloxicam is the generic name for metacam. ;)
 
Ouch! Yes, I would bet that was the "root" of his problem. Actually, I'm always relieved when it's "just teeth" because I have three vets who I trust to handle dentals.

One of my guys does get poopy butt just before needing his teeth done (he is the only one of many "teeth bunnies" to have this symptom) ... so you might keep an eye on that. Could be that the motion to harvest cecals makes the pain from spurs worse.

Kathy
 
You know it really surprises me that so mny vets (at least here) look at the front teeth and say .."Oh the teeth are fine .."

The same thing happened to Beau ..his molars were a mess



I like "The molar spur club " :)
 
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