Mucoid Enteritis

[murph72]

I have a Holland lop that I recently brought home. She's almost three months old now and I've had her home here since she was around 9 weeks old. She was doing great and is super friendly. Her behavior has not changed. However, when I put her out to run today she was showing signs of a loss of balance and control in her hind legs. She's in with two other young does, but I examined the tray under their pen to see if anything looked amiss. There are some droppings that look like they could be mucoid enteritis. There's not a high concentration of mucous, but there is some mishappen droppings and some of the new ones look "glossy" for a lack of a better word.

I started her on a dose of neomycin and plan to give two a day. I also started giving her a Benebac, Pedialyte, and Critical Care mixture. She's not fond of the forced feedings, but I figure it's for her own good. This treatment is what was recommended by my vet when I had another little one show these same symptoms...however, it was not successful. In the end, we had to put him to sleep. Has anyone had success treating mucoid enteritis? If so, what did you use? Also, was your little one showing signs of a loss of balance.

I do know that a loss of balance can be a symptom of E.C. However, I don't believe that is what this is. I've had an E.C. bunny before and this is not presenting in a similar fashion. It looks exactly like my last bunny that had enteritis.

 

[jamesedwardwaller]

i would advise a visit to an exotic specialist/asap,.definately there is something amis,and don,t want you wasting your time with speculation,..once a treatment is in place then let us know,.sincerely james waller

 

[murph72]

Unfortunately James that is not an option in my very rural area. There are no specialists within any kind of reasonable (I mean within three hours one way) of my home. The stress on a bunny for such a long ride would likely doom them. In my area it is unlikely to find a vet that has any clue about rabbit issues as they, admittedly, see very few of them. Be glad you have an experienced exotic vet as the best we have within any driving distance isn't experienced enough to even spay a rabbit. I'd like to help this rabbit but I'm limited as to how to help her. I'd like to try something before euthanasia is the only option. In my area we educate ourselveson rabbit illnesses because we're the only shot our rabbits have of surviving any of those illnesses. I can't count the number of times that I've told my vet what the issue was and what I'd like to have as the treatment.

 

[naturestee]

I wonder if she has a spinal injury? That can cause both the hind limb problem and the fecal problem. She could have spooked in her cage, been playing too roughly, etc. It happens sometimes. If this is the problem (need xray to confirm), she might heal with time and steroid shots to reduce swelling.

To be safe, I'd separate her from the other buns.

The way you describe the droppings, it could also be a coccidia infection.

When I dealt with mucoid enteritis (2 week old Dora) it was green and unformed. It's sloppy stuff and would probably be on at least some of the hair around the bun's anus. We pulled her through with Benebac and a mixture of Pedialyte, cecals from a healthy rabbit, and a tiny bit of her milk mix. She did need sub-q fluids from the vet the next morning as we hadn't been able to get her to swallow enough water to make up for the diarrhea. Dora's sibling died of the same problem because we hadn't been able to get him to swallow anything at all and he dehydrated quickly.

Best of luck, I hope she's ok!

 

[aurora369]

I would definitely be giving lots of fluids. Pedialyte works well.

Do you think there is a possibility of an ear infection causing a loss of balance?

Or is there any possible way she injured her back?

--Dawn

 

[murph72]

Her spine feels fine when you run your fingers down it. It's not that she doesn't have any control, which I'd expect from a broken back...it's more like her legs don't always do what she wants them to do.

I didn't think coccidia because from what I've read this causes wicked diarrhea, which she doesn't have. She has had more droppings that look like either longer than normal and a bit glossy looking (maybe two to three times the normal length of a dropping) and some that look like little grapey nuggets that are formed together. Her bum region is really clean too.

I may call over to my not so experienced vet and ask if bringing in a fecal sample would be of use to him. How "new" does a fecal sample need to be? Should it be refrigerated?

 

[murph72]

Oh, and her ears look super clean...I'm not seeing any sign of an infection there.

 

[Flashy]

You can't always see if there is an ear infection, sometimes it needs to be cultured, other times it is too far in (I believe).

What you are describing, some of them at least, sound like uneaten cecals. I wonder if she can't eat her cecals due to whatever is going on in her back end.

What diet is it she is on? Is it the same as before she came?

 

[murph72]

Naturestee, from what I found on this site, the green in the droppings you describe sounds more like Coccidia: http://www.welshrabbitry.com/health.html#mucoid

If you scroll up there is also a section on coccidia.

 

[tonyshuman]

Here is the Merck Vet Manual reference:
http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/171319.htm

In the references I've read, I haven't heard of loss of balance and control in the hind legs. How did your vet determine that the previous rabbit had mucoid enteritis? What did they do to treat it?

The poo you're describing doesn't sound a lot like what I've read about it either.

The age seems too young for EC, plus it has set on too quickly.

Here are some other articles about mucoid enteritis, including treatments:
http://www.threelittleladiesrabbitry.com/mucoidenteritis.php
http://rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=9089&forum_id=1&highlight=enteritis
http://rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=8117&forum_id=1&highlight=enteritis
http://www.radil.missouri.edu/info/dora/RABBPAGE/mis.htm#III.

I worry that something else is the problem. Is this rabbit related to the previous one? Is it the same feed?

Here is our library link on diarrhea: http://www.rabbitsonline.net/view_topic.php?id=11935&forum_id=10

On MediRabbit, it says acute paralysis with rapid onset can be due to high potassium in the blood: http://www.medirabbit.com/EN/Neurology/Differentials/paresis.htm

I agree that a vet visit soon is in order. If that's not possible, could you please describe the poo more and how the vet determined it was mucoid enteritis in the previous rabbit, and how it was treated? I'm not sure that is what is going on here.

A loss of movement would tell me that the toxins released by the bacteria are in the system and causing problems, which would be a very late stage of the disease. It's also not common for mucoid enteritis to cause hind leg issues from what I've read.

 

[murph72]

I think before she came she was only on the same pellets as I'm feeding her. I think she didn't get any timothy hay, which she seems to love. The only additives I made were the timothy hay and a couple of Cheerios each night as a treat. When I got her she was missing some hair, which is usually an indication that one of the other bunnies in with her over-groomed her. I see this in rabbitries that aren't providing the hay, so she probably had a deficiency in that area.

 

[murph72]

Claire, the rabbit is not related to the other, which was a mini lop. The other rabbit passed probably back in March or April. My vet, I think, gave his best guess on the mucoid enteritis. He listened to my symptoms and said he thought that was the issue. That tends to be what we get in our rabbit vets around here...they "think" that it is a certain problem and then they diagnose it on that guess. I'm just glad when I don't walk out with their cure-all: Baytril

 

[tonyshuman]

Ok, that link you posted does have loss of balance as a symptom of mucoid enteritis. However, shiny poops and uneaten cecals are not uncommon in a healthy bunny. My guys have shiny poops (depending on how fresh they are) and occasionally don't eat a cecal or two (like if they get distracted while they're supposed to be eating them).

 

[murph72]

Oh, and the feed has long been consumed by my multitude of bunnies....so it can't be a contamination of feed. I haven't seen any signs of distress in the other bunnies either.

 

[tonyshuman]

I see, that is a frustrating vet! I think if you can get this girl to eat hay, that would be good. Things like Bene-Bac, Pedialyte and Critical Care will help. I honestly can't tell what's going on here, but it does seem strange that two rabbits would get it within a few months of each other, unrelated, etc. That makes me think it's not an injury to the spine, but very few other things cause hind leg movement difficulty...

 

[murph72]

It seemed like a lot of uneaten cecals...mind you, there's three rabbits in there...but it leads me to believe that one of them is producing a lot and not eating them...no?

Are you thinking spinal injury is more likely? If that is the case, I can ask for an x-ray. You'd think they could get an x-ray right. If it is an issue with her back, you suggested steriods? Any other things I can do with her to help her heal?

It seems weird I'd end up with two bunnies with back problems in such a short period of time though.

 

[murph72]

Oh no, I think we're having the same thoughts at the same time. :biggrin2: At least I know I'm not out in left field (at least not by myself anyway) then.

 

[murph72]

Do you think I should put her on a more solid surface so that her cecals can't escape her? I could always put a bottom down in one of the pens so that the droppings don't fall through.

 

[tonyshuman]

Yes, it's good to have at least part of the cage with a solid floor so they can eat cecals.

It's true that the most common causes of paralysis in the hind end are spinal trauma and EC. It would be rare to get two bunnies with spinal trauma in such a short time, unless there is something wrong with the cage or they're in the habit of jumping down from heights. EC doesn't make sense because of the quick progression of the disease and the rabbit's age.

Steroids can be helpful in some spinal injuries if given very soon after. They're not the greatest for rabbits because they suppress the immune system and that can allow the many bacteria that usually coexist happily with rabbits to grow out of control (for example, pasturella). B vitamins are better, I think.

I would guess that loss of balance and hind leg control could come from the whole body shutting down due to bacterial toxins overwhelming the system, but the rabbit would be listless and dull-eyed as well, I would think.

Is there any chance she jumped in a way that hurt her back? Do any wild animals come by the cage that might have scared her into running into a wall? If so, an x-ray is probably in order along with steroids and B vitamins.

There are also some leg issues like splay leg that can occur when a rabbit is raised on flooring that's difficult to stand on, like all wire, or slippery surfaces. However, they're not fatal in themselves.

 

[naturestee]

Spinal injuries come different "strengths." Some are more like a bruise and the swelling causes the problems, others are cracks or very slight breaks which you also couldn't feel but can cause anywhere from mild to serious problems. I would think a normal cat/dog vet could do an xray on a rabbit. Then you'll know for sure.

I agree that a solid cage floor might help her get to her cecals if she's having hind end problems. It might also get messy... vinegar is your friend.

Murphy, Dora's fecals were cultured and our (rabbit savvy) vet found Clostridium to be the only problem. She had on/off problems from that and had to be treated with antibiotics and Benebac for several weeks. FYI a cat/dog vet should be able to do a fecal culture as many of the problem critters are the same. For example, one of my cats had problems with coccidia as a kitten.