Orchid
Well-Known Member
We started here...
11/10 - so much to say and so much to share, but now is not the time....He has had a bit of an upset tummy and we are working on resolving this issue.
11/11 - We brought Dougal home on Sunday and everything was ok and all very very exciting...but small problems started occuring...
and now...
Now I am pretty scared...and I hate this...
His interest in his pellets, hay, and now it seems like his water are decreasing...the poops are getting stuck in everything and actually smell bad now.
We are going now to get a weight on him..and pick up some pedialyte.
Following the advice of some great people...
Breeder did say he was treated for cocci...already..
So I guess I am asking...for everyone to please pray for him...think good thoughts...
I do not think we could take losing him too..this quick...all too much..
11/12 - Dougal likes oats...his breeder said try some...so we did. Wonderful woman...she really cares and is upset he is under the weather....called the other buns from his litter to see if anyone else was having problems...just us...I am hoping it was stress is all...
Weebles wobble...he wobbled lol...trying to clean his ears..
I am feeling better about things...I am going to be watching closely...he will be going to the vet on Friday...but I feel that everything will settle down..
and can you believe my 9 week old baby is only 4.3 pounds!!
11/12- The pellets I laid down he really did not touch...loved the oats..and will pick through the pumpkin or pellets..to eat every last one.
I decided to go ahead and give the C.C. again this morning at like 9:30am my time...He likes it well enough and ate all of it really without issue...lifting his head to try to get more out of the syringe etc..
Gave him the Bene bac...the gas drops...
It does not look to me, like he really ate any of his hay over the night...
I did however find that cecals were smushed into his belly and butt fur...I used a wire brush to get them out...wasnt too bad of a fight...and the crusted over chin of his from last nights feeding.
He is still ignoring his pellets, barely nibbles at the hay...Gave him some oat hay...same story.
So we all sorta napped after this morning..Lina stayed up but snuggled in here, in my bed. She said he never left his box..
I have since removed the box...hoping it would encourage him to move about..and it did for a moment or two...he shifted shelves and is now on the lower one...
Which I have been thinking of taking out completely as he pees all over it and not even in the corners...and only this shelf..
No new poops really..a few scattered tiny tiny ones..
Dougal was laying in his litter pan when 4:30 came....grabbed him up anf fed 30cc of the C.C. to him...he fought me some...
When all was done...he walked around pushing my hands and legs but not for pets...felt more like a get away woman ..nudge,,...
Since...that he has curled up on my chest, held in a towel.....and does not seem to care about anything...I have been sneezing and blowing my nose..he doesnt even flinch...at one point he was sitting strange with his ears straight down his back...
He has stopped eating oats, pellets, and the hay now it seems too...
I can hear him nashing his teeth...he is right next to my ear...
I hear tummy noises, but nothing that sounds alarming..
poop an pee ??
His skin/fur tell me he is hydrated for the moment...
His eyes are closed.,..he doesnt seem to want to move...
and of course right when I typed that he got up walked around to my legs and did a dead bunny flop right against my thigh...
11/13 - ok...so tonight I made Dougal come out of my room and spend time with us in the living room...he was glued to me...and at one point when I said enough (as I was trying to eat my dinner) he huffed away and went into his/my/our bedroom and laid down in his litter pan...fine...
He has indeed been peeing all over the lower shelf...and so I did remove it...now there sits this LONG litter pan where the shelf was...he can however get back up to the second level as I left a "step"....
Decided to take a bath..and dumped some more hay into his pans..I sorta shoved it in his face in a hope that he would get annoyed and go to move it and in doing so decide to eat it...it worked and it didnt...He checked out and munched a bit of the organic meadow hay and ignored the timothy...ok...least he nibbled...
All poop seems to have ceased...cecals and all...I see nothing..that scares me...
Had a thought as I cleaned a litter pan...could he have ingested some of the yesterday news litter? If so, what exactly could it do...it is something I thought of to ask the vet today...when we go in 9 hours...
I fed him at 4:30 and again at 12:30am...but I dropped 30ml to 10ml...
If I am feeding him and pushing fluids...why would he need to bother to do it for himself..I am hoping he will get hungry enough to take a look at least at the buffet he has laying around...
After I gave the 10ml of CC..which smells like warmed up apples...I thought..what if I take his pellets, drop warm water onto them making them soft...sprinkly the Critical Care on top..since he seems to like it so very much..and maybe like trick him into eating it..getting him to think it is the same thing...as he did look like he wanted more then what I gave him..
He took one sniff...ONE...and walked away...BRAT!
He proceeded to lay out all over my bed as if it was put here for the sole purpose for his comfort...
I still cant help to smile..
Dougal...started munching his hay again...I have noticed he by passes the greener ones and goes for, lighter colored pieces....
11/13- 9am
Went to sleep late....after feeding the baby boy..and messing around here on RO...
I randomly slightly woke up here and there when would feel Dougal throw himself against my thighs...It would seem he loves to lay at the end of the bed by my feet or legs...Any time I would open my eyes he was there...
Alarm goes off...Scares the crap out of him...and he takes off like he can fly...I felt bad...
So I sit up and put my hand down....um...ICK...Well the cecals have returned....lots of little piles here and there...but this one I stuck my hand in...I do not know what it was, but pure mush and nasty smelling...FUN ...I was pretty glad I had beach towels spread out all over my bed...even though he did actually pee on my blankets last night....so now I have an naked bed while everything washes...
Dougal never did eat any of that mix I tried for him...or even the plain pellets...
This morning though he spent a little time eating his hay...the organic meadow one....and I did see him drinking..
Oddly ...there are no regular poops...where the heck are they? If there are cecals I would assume he is not blocked? so why is he not pooping anything else at all?
He was do for a feeding about an hour ago...but I have let it come and go without feeding him..It seemed to me he started liking it too much...I didnt even have to hold him last time...he chased me onto the bed when he smelled it and sat there pretty as you please eating and reaching for the syringe....and looking for more when it was gone....hmmm....
Dumped all the pellets that were out...oats too...and put down a small bit of fresh pellets.. Got his carrier ready...put a blanket in it and some hay...he has walked on it, over it, in it a few times checking things out...but being a good boy for the most part....
Would seem since I took down the low shelf...he will not go on the higher shelf...
I suppose that is all for now...
11/13-6pm
Now on to Dougal...
My poor boy!!! He was 4.3lbs on Wed at 5:30 pm, by Friday at 10:30am he is now..3.54
That scared the crap out me...
Then the doc comes in talking about a doughy tummy, wants to keep him and do all sorts of stuff talking over 400 bucks...my heart drops thinking I just cant do that!
Fecal comes back and she says it is filled,...LOADED with cocci...I asked if they would allow the subQ fluids to come home with me and let me do it, as that would be much cheaper then letting him stay there...an 80 dollar difference...
If I had all the money in the world I would have done everything and anything they wanted..but I have to live in real life...even when it is scary as death...
So push comes to shove and what we have is a little boy off his food and hay, has some GI Stasis going on, with concern about toxic build ups, and what the Cocci is doing to him...
What is coming out...no form to it at all now...
They treated him with everything about noon...and sent us on our way...
He is getting CC every 4 hours until he starts eating on his own again.
1 gram of bene bac, 1 gram of bio sponge every day.
40ml of Sodium Chloride Fluid two times a day.
0.8 of Albon every day
and for pain, Meloxicam 0.2 once a day.
and pedialyte....
He ate 40cc of CC earlier..stayed with me for a time huddled and sleeping I suppose, in a blanket for awhile, right next to me..so I kicked on the TV as I could not move and what was on?? Howard the Duck..Holy crap...is that one old...Could not believe my eyes lol...
So my daughter comes home and I explain what is going on, what needs to be done and what I expect of her...of course she gets upset and says she does not want him to die..neither do I, I said to her...
She has been helping to get things done, clean and disinfect.
He jumped down after a bit, right before I got a call lol..and went to sit in the corner...where he seemed to be pushing his butt into the corner panel of his cage..
:cry4::dunno
He is still ignoring his food dish and water bowl...but eats a piece of hay every once in a while..
We feed again at 8 )2 hours away) and do the SubQ at 9..
He has gone through a lot and his body is going through a lot and I hope that is all there is to his behaviors now...
Looking forward to seeing him feel better and perhaps share a binky and a kiss with me again..
11/14 -
So last night I was nothing but a puddle of shaking nerves after everything was said and done...I fell asleep before midnight came so he missed out on that feeding...I also over slept and did not get up until 9am...
I was just so exhausted...I woke up though to the sound of chewing....
Dougal was running around his cage, munching on hays...peeing all over the place...like standing in the litter pans but hanging his rear over the edge and I swear it looked like on purpose...All 3 corners of the cage he will pee in, even off the shelves.....Been thinking what will he do if I make his cage into a circle AH HA! But any way...
He seemed so much better that I just sat here watching him for a bit wondering if I should feed the CC and give the SubQ...but I realised that though he is feeling better, he is not all better...and he also was not eating those pellets still...So against my protesting nerves...sigh....I went ahead and made up the CC, 20ml....gave the bio sponge...which FYI is HARD as heck to get out of the tube! Gave the Bene Bac, Gas drops just in case...and backed off for a few...Then gave the pain meds and waited a bit before I went ahead with another round of the SubQ....
Now see I know from working in an animal hospital you do not want to reuse a needle over and over because every time you puncture...it gets a little more dull.
Now if only Dougal understood that!!!!!
He fought me every step of the way this morning...feeding, meds...and with the subQ he was worse then yesterday and while I was not calm..I was calmer!
I think I had to poke him...lord...4-5 times at least. I managed to hold onto him during the end and even though I was worried I might be hurting him I could see no other way to hold him and get the fluids in...Well we got it done!
Now he has this little white crock he likes to drink from...it was actually meant for creme burle or however you spell it...it was bone dry this morning...it is maybe a cup total. He has oat in the rack, orchard in the small pan, timothy on the blanket, orangic meadow in the big pan...I have seen him munch on all but the orchard today...and I swear I hear what sounds like farts coming out of him..(His rear smells something awful!!)
His ears are up today..he is way more active...biting us etc..
I clipped his nails last night because I couldnt take it anymore...I was getting scratched all to hell...him and his baby daggers...There was barely anything to cut and though I tried to be careful I snipped one toenail too far...He bit me for that and well yeah I know it hurt
He has been biting more...just bit Angelina for picking poop up out of his cage...
He is grooming...and like taking a drink and what looks like licking his butt...taking a drink, repeat...he does look a bit frazzled...The sub Q did get all over his back...and while I know he is not getting all of the 40cc's...he is getting most of it,...
I would hate to say we are out of the woods and have something go wrong....but really that is what my gut is telling me...
I am seeing poops of all sorts now...and no cecals...go figure.
He still has smush...but he has solids coming now as well...
11/14 -
We ran out today..few errands...we were gone awhile...Got back in the door..and it did look like he had pushed his pellets around some...but his water looked untouched..
I am hearing VERY loud noises coming from him at random times. I have resumed the gas drops just in case..and while I am NO bun expert...his stomach seems too round, and out...
I fed him once again...got 30cc down with a fight...
I feed
http://www.mannapro.com/rabbit.htm
I wish I had been able to get the mana gro now though being he is go young, but they did not sell it anyway.
Random note...did you know a 50 pound bag of oxbow timothy pellets costs about 78 bucks
The receptionist at the vet was promoted oxbow and trying to get me away from the dark side ya know...but...BA...
Tried the Brome hay with him...same result...nibble nibble..walk away.
Not a whole lot of poo since the first round of clean up this morning..but he is pooing..and that is what is important for the moment....
Those really are some seriously loud tummy noises...hmmm
I got the Albon down him...and was glad I decided to give it at different times, as it would seem...you are not supposed to give it WITH the bio Sponge..which may I add is impossible to give the way it is..you really need to measure it out and stick it in some CC or something...crap is like clay...and even though in his mouth...swallowing it? yeah....
I can see now just how not well he must have been feeling to, if he would not fight about anything...to see just how much a fuss he makes now...
24 hours...made a huge difference...
I put out a 1/4 cup of his pellets..So if he starts eating...I will have an idea how much he got down...
I am hoping he starts eating ok by tomorrow night...doing this and trying to work, get her to school and everything..way stressful...
11/14 -
He has been fighting me harder to not eat the CC...but he is not eating enough pellets...but if I am filling him up on CC why would he eat? How does one walk that fine line?
I am dreading 9pm....du du du dum...SUBQ..no fun...seriously I think I need to take like 4 Klonopins before I try to give him fluids again...I HATE IT!
He has been sitting on his shelf...his butt pressed up to the wall...Have not seen him doing much of anything...brought him out and gave some more gas drops...those noises in the tummy are scaring me...They are so loud..like really loud...like I am 6 feet away and I am like WHAT...was that you? Tried to touch the tum, give a rub...he didnt like that...bit at me...bugger...but when I started petting him he started licking my sweater lol...
Angelina said she saw him at his pellets earlier...we are seeing more and more solid poos...some smushy stuff still..but not nasty smushy or smelly..
SCREAMS! I HATE HATE HATE when I lose my connection and everything I typed...
He has been eating from his dish so I think I am going to skip the 8pm feed...
One of the last things I had typed a minute ago was I wish I would see him eating more of his hay...and he just jumped into the litter pan and started munching...perhaps they can not just understand you when you speak..lmao
This is the Bun hut...
http://www.oxbowanimalhealth.com/products/type/detail?object=1593
I am giving 80cc of fluids per day...leaves him what...60 to make up on his own? I am hoping things perk up...
I hate having to fight him with all this...SO NOT FUN...and being 15 pounds...lord.
(He peed in the pan!)
He did this wiggle jiggle thing up on the shelf...he was drinking and grooming..which is funny cause he totters when he trys to clean his ears...anyway he did this thing that reminds me of a dog shaking off water and he has this cute poofy fluff tail..rather long..It was super cute! He bun flopped on the floor
I have seen that sort of tude...like Zeus...when I am sleeping and catch him on my bed he dashes off my bed like it wasnt him, he wasnt there look lol...I think Dougal would like something cushy and snuggly like a foofy dog bed...seeing as how much he likes MY bed...
Though he avoids it more then he wants to jump on it...cant blame the poor guy at this point...
I do tell him no firmly and push his head down when he bites me...I let him have at the blankets when he gets like that...but I have told Lina she needs to tell him a firm no and push his head down gently...I am afraid she could hurt him...and so I push for her doing the firm no...over anything else...yet I think a lot of this is the meds being pushed on him...Though I know he needs to learn..no matter what he cant bite..
got every thing out, all ready to go and he starts eating his hay...so I think, I will wait till he stops...but he comes down to his pellets and starts eating those...and so I think...I will wait till he is done with those...but he goes and flops ever so cutely on the floor in the corner and I did not have the heart to grab him for the subQ....
I do not want him thinking any time we are around, or he comes down to eat his pellets or hay, hangs out on the floor that something bad will happen...
Angelina is laying on the floor in his pen and he is sitting on her back sniffing her out..and looking up at me
I have noticed he is rather clumsy on the whole...he will miss when he jumps, pretty much almost fall over when he cleans his ears..and some other stuff...I keep thinking it is cause he is a baby..but I do not recall Simon having such problems when he was a baby with us...
And he jumped in the pan to eat more hay!!
I am so freakin torn about how and when to handle this...
I want to encourage and not scare him to never come off his top shelf again...
Until I pulled out the needles and fluid...he had been just chillin on his shelf....
11/15
Dougal is definitely a morning boy...which goes against my very nature lol...
You can hear him running up and down...eating, jumping, munching hay...but when you turn to look he goes and lays down...like he is hiding lol.
I woke up to find his water dish bone dry and his food bowl the same. The water dish holdsa half cup of water! I am not doing SubQ this morning. I am also not Feeding the CC except to get the meds down.
I refilled the water and the food and added some oats which he was most happy to have.
Last night went ok with the fluids. I only had to stick him once and he only tried to escape twice...which he was not able to.I tried to give a bit of oats from my hand as a peace offering...well he ate them, but he bites to pick up...Simon used to lick anything in your hand...
I very much think we are on the mend! Everything is going to be great!
I made of some CC and squirted the right amount of the bio-sponge in it, added a little more CC and then the Bene Bac...why not get it all is one shot right? So that is two grams of meds, with the CC, made of a full 10cc of it all...He also had his pain meds too..but I am wondering if we really need to continue them..Later on he will get his Albon...Which is at about 4pm I think we will do...You are not supposed to give the Bio-Sponge with anything...
I am beginning to think the organic meadow hay is his favorite. He munches that one the most out of them all.
I brought the water dish and most of the hay down off the shelf now...seeing as he feels better I see no reason why he can not come down to eat and drink. I only left it up there because he was sick and I wanted him to have easy access to encourage.. His litter pans...I use my hands and grab out the wet litter, all the poops and old hay...I sanitize my hands and then put new litter and hay in the pans...He seems to have really picked up peeing in the pans! He did pee on my bed again today though...it was not a lot so I am thinking it is a marking thing...My bed is right next to his cage....
I have decided to rearrange it some and make it more fitting for him...that step is too short a space for him...need to make things easier to come and go from without hurting himself...
His poops are back still...some are pretty darn dark...would even go as far as to say black...but he is pooping! No where near as much squashy poo today as well...however his rear still stinks something awful...
I will watch and wait...see how he eats and drinks by 8pm....and if he is ok...I will not feed or SubQ him...should he eat nothing and drink nothing I will go ahead with both...but I do not think that will happen.
He has been eating...He also did have like...8cc maybe of the CC earlier becauseI put two meds in it...so I am assuming that tamped down his urge to eat a bit...but he has nibbled a time or two...He has been chewing a fair amount of hay today...
Only found one pile of cecals and they looked much better than what I had been seeing...
(He is eating whats left of the oats...only gave him a bit
I put down a kitty pan...the two sided plastic dish...a bit of oat in one side, pellets in the other...His cup however is full...untouched since it was filled at like 9am...
What do you think...if it stays full until like 8pm tonight...(5 hours from now)...should I go ahead and give the SubQ again?
Last night was not as bad as the other times...and I also stopped using the back of the neck like they showed me..and used more in the middle of his back how I learned years ago...he was much calmer...I think it hurt less...and I am sure that skin around his neck has to be sore as heck now..
11/16
Woke up to a noisy bunny! He really seems to like mornings lol...He quiets down once we all get up, stand up etc.
Lots o poo in the pen! Nice spot in the litter pan...was happy to see that pile. He ate all of the alfalfa hay I had put out last night, drank a 1/4 cup of water from what I could tell....I had also put another 1/4 cup of pellets in the dish...so that would be like a 1/2 of cup total I suppose he ate yesterday/this morning. I filled both sides of the dish with 1/4 cup of pellets sprinkled with oats before I left and refilled his water.
He was none to pleased with me giving the meds again today...but we got it done. I will give the Albon again this evening and watch to see how he drinks for the rest of the day...I will give him till 8pm tonight again...if nothing has really been drunk I will do SubQ again...
Angelina said he did a binky this morning but I did not see it. I let him out into the living room while I got the CC ready that I put the Bio Sponge into....He only stayed out for a few minutes. I wish I had been able to catch the binky.....
11/17
I noticed last night he had started drinking..and that his water needed a refill this morning as well. He has been eating any where from 1/4-1/2 cup of pellets a day...and some oats.
He managed last night to get up on my bed...leave tons of poop and pee too. I was out in the living room at the time on the phone. I am still trying to figure if he jumped the two high NIC or got around it some how...
Lina is cleaning up the poop and there are tons of little ones all over, and two piles of cecals...none look too squishy. He is still is peeing every where.
I suppose I am not so good at potty training. I would love see Dougal catch on and never poop or pee any where but his pans...I have been considering moving his pen into the living room making it more secure...Then I will not have to worry about him getting under my stuff or on the bed.....or jumping out. I have this feeling I am going to have to close the top up..not leave it open anymore...
Since he is feeling better....he has much more tude...DOES NOT like me, but is licking Angelina, butting her, jumping in her lap, cleaning her hair
He runs from me...I would run from me too though if I was him...
11/21
Dougal had seemed to very much be improving...even his potty habits started getting better when we shrank down to the dog crate and took him out of the palace.
He has been fighting me about taking the Bio-Sponge however...and it has gotten to the point where none of it is getting into him. He simply will no longer swallow it. No matter what I try, what I put it in or not, he will not swallow or eat it. He will eat the Bene and Albon no problem however. Can not say I blame the little guy, the stuff really is like sculpting clay...
His pen was a mess this morning...the smush has returned and he has stopped eating his cecals again as of yesterday...I am concerned about him, his attitude and behaviors...
he is biting at anything he does not like regardless of how you try to correct him...he does not listen. I constantly wonder how he manages to get poop only in the large water dish but not the small white one.
He will eat oats no problem...but he is starting to slack with the pellets again...and his drinking is again a concern to me.
I opened the other Bene Bac today...the other one was done. Not much left of the first CC package I opened for this...but I do have another one of those as well. I am glad I have both and that we still have SubQ left...We just may end up needing it.
I keep thinking I need to go back to work for a Vet...so I can get discounts on these things...The needles and Fluid I could get at least...
He has been poopy, stinky...and sorta lazy today.
Last night he was not all that different but he was running around and doing some binkys. And he only let three poops out onto the carpet. MUCH BETTER!
BUT...I see no real poop today....except for what was in the cage. It took awhile to clean as well because I made my daughter do it. She was up before me and did not bother to even check on him, give him new/fresh/more water...food etc...when this has been a constant conversation...
Even last night we were talking about Simon and how she felt it was her fault he died because she was not pulling her weight...We talked about how it did not matter what she did or did not do...as I was taking care of him...and it did not matter he would have passed on either way....
I am nervous with Dougal on many levels...
This illness we seem unable to shake...
Dougal seems unable to sit, but has to FLOP! The boy is a flopping fool...8 out of 10 times...if he goes to lay down, he throws himself down...it is quite entertaining to be honest.
He tried to be spider bunny when we were cleaning the crate....but I was smart enough to have those buggers be 3 high...though I felt bad turning to see him fall back to the ground...I always worry a bun will hurt themselves with that sort of fall. I kept the NIC cubes connected and keep them for a pen when we need it...
Honestly though I am really rather quite concerned...I suppose he reinfected himself with the cocci again...but we have been doing all the meds as we are supposed to...how is it this started all over again?
11/22
Well Dougal has decided he likes eating my carpet. Try to stop him butshort of keeping him in the pen all day every day I dont know how to stop him. We try yelling, stomping, water bottle...does not phase him in the least.
Still having smushy poo...but he eat a fair amount over the night and morning....but I am still concerned about his water intake...I have started spiking his water with white grape juice....everything new to him...he does not seem to want or even smell, try etc.
I did not give the Bio-Sponge today...it was such a nightmare yesterday and today would have been the last day anyway,....He just will not swallow it no matter what I do, how I try to trick him
With the smushy poo I wonder should I continue the Bene.....Today was supposed to be the last day for that...
Random... (god bless brown paper bags)....
Yeah I know...but we have been pretty on top of things except for him eating the cecals....
He started the Albon on Nov 13 and has been, and will get it till Nov 26.
I am hoping things get out of his system by then.
am considering either trying to force him to drink via syringe...but leaning towards the SubQ...because I know that will actually get into him...but man I know he will struggle and fight me to death about it.
I am concerned about his lack of water intake...
Yet he is eating with no issues again today...
11/22 4pm
He still has the runs coming...he has not really drank any of the water since he was cleaned up today...WORRIED!
11/23
He drank well enough and ate good over the night...
CLeaned up, dumped his litter, refreshed everything...walked away for a minute and boom...skids everywhere on the brown paper bags....
I am worried about this...
Is it possible for a bun to be unable to kick the Cocci even with meds?
11/24 -
Well lets see hmmmm.
Smushy poo today, but it seems to have a pattern, odd as that may seem..
Dougal has started again with the runs...not just icky cecals, but the actual runs...not total liquid, but getting close. Only seems to hit at certain times of the day...Like after 8am and on....till the afternoon ish...
Started back 3 days ago.
His drinking has slacked off along with his eating...BUT
He will eat any and all oats you give him...He will drink some water when I add the white grape juice to it...and today he seems to be eating and drinking better...
I am concerned the cocci has come back...could it be he has some sort of tolerance to the Albon?
It is like it got better and still came back. He has been on the Albon since we went to the vet on the 13 and his last dose is the 26th...
I am unsure what to think....
wanted to start themix of mana, wheat germ, oats..and maybe something I am forgetting...
I had been thinking of trying to buy it all and start giving it to him to help make sure he is gaining enough weight...but I am not sure I should now.
I have been boiling any water he gets...and of course letting it cool before he gets it...
We have been cleaning and changing his pans...scooping out poop when we see it...Using hand sanatizer etc...
Had to take out the carpet because we have noticed he is picking up strands and eating them....so we rolled it up and have it sitting in Angelina room for now...sigh...
--
After chatting withCathy/BlueGiants...
I decided to ditch the oxbow hays and try for a fresh bale. I was able to find one place that is an ok drive to get to...A compressed 50lb bale of timothy/alfalfa hay...cost only like 12 bucks! Picked up the probiotic stuff for horses...it is like double the amount and more then less then half the cost...awesome...the calf mana they said whenthey have it even cheaper then at the tractor supply store. HE was also trying to talk me into starting a pellet they sell..
yeah..all good and well but I can not even get hisstomach settled on the rather plain diet he is already on...not going togo changing his pellets right now....I do not think I will period...unless something health related makes a difference with that choice.
Stopping everything except the bene....
He has been coming and going from the hay...which is more than I could say before..
The Brome did smell like vinegar..made me wonder...
Makes me wonder about all oxbow products really...
---------
The poopies have been irregular again since this started, but a good amount of them are uniform, round, firm...
He is being picky with the hays again...one minute he will eat the brome and the next he will not go near it...we have 5 kinds and I keep switching a bit to keep his interest..
I had been giving - Welchs, 100% White Grape Juice, from concentrate with added ingredients. - No Sugar Added - 120% Vitamin C
Says on label - total fat 0, sodium 1%, Total Carb 13% with this listed with it -Sugars 38g**, Protein 0g
The ** says contains natural fruit sugars only
No Artifical flavors or colors added.
Says it is easier on young stomachs than apple juice.
I did stop the SubQ, but I could start it again if we have to. I do have the supplies left for at least a few days more...maybe 3? Could possibly pick up more if needed...
I stopped the Bio Sponge...so he missed one dose yesterday...I just could not get it into him any more...he started spitting it back out, not swallowing etc a few days ago...no matter what I put it in or tried to do.
I Gave him more Bene Bac today just cause...but that was supposed to end yesterday too.
The pain meds we stopped awhile ago, but I might have a day or two.
LOL- I never bothered to smell it before, but yeah it smells like cake batter...We have a bunch left for now..supposed to stop that on Thursday.
He has had nothing at all since he came to us except for the pellets, oxbows hays, and the generic brand of Oats from Walmart I think it might be...Not the instant kind.
No carrots, greens, not even the papaya tablets...Since we have not been able to achieve a healthy norm without meds I was not going to try anything new....
Every thing was exactly the same when it went from 1 day to the next and everything went to smush again. Nothing had changed at that time...I started adding the WHite Grape to the water when I saw he was slacking off...he tends to pass it up really though...odd boy that he is...and it is very very diluted...like maybe...1cc? to a little more then a half of cup of boiled water...
So yeah I am stopping the Albon for now..giving his system a rest....and the White Grape...already took it away..and just the plain boiled water for him...
This is the site I found on the new hay we are trying out..
http://www.standleehay.com/home.aspx
His poos have seemed normal for awhile now.
He was acting slightly strange earlier,...running and hiding from us...but he stopped.
Any time he knows we are in his cage he tends to get upset...he will nudge you and push..jump back in and get right in your way...lol
He made cleaning and disinfecting everything again today quite a chore.
This cage attitude he has worries me slightly for when he is older...maybe he will grow out of it.
Angelina and Dougal are bonding well to eachother...it helped he starting licking her now...she feels so relieved and happy. Awesome what a bunny can do...
He will come up to the couch, but only stays a minute..he did flop right against the couch on the floor, right below where my head/hands were....I thought that was sweet of him.
I used the vanodine my friend sent me today to clean up everything...though now I am totally out of litter...BAH!
Well...we have hay to last quite some time..(please please please eat it a lot) and a pellet he is eating REALLY well...a cup or more, maybe up to 2 cups per day on an awesome day...now I just need to stock on litter and we should be good...unless his health takes a dip...
It is so green right? I was like wow this cant be real lol...So used to oxbow crap and man it seems like crap now compared to how fresh this seems (and smells from a distance)
ok...I just hope it stays playful...
He has actually been out since like about noon-ish...about 5 almost now..he has been hanging out at the edge where the carpet goes to hardwood...we have a nic fence and litter pan over there...kind behind my glider chair...he has been back in there almost all day..but ok.
He has come out to play...keeps trying to eat Angelina's letters to her Family in NY....lol I warned her though not to let him actually get at any of it...the pencils, the pink erasers etc...
Well already the poop seems to be improving...lots of cecal piles thatcould have become hay pattys if we had not cleaned up..but it is not smushy as before...he does have that stinky smell following though...keep joking we should have named him Stinky Butt instead of Dougal lol...
Trying the Vanilla in the water but he turned his nose at it...so oh well...we will see what the next day or so brings...
11/10 - so much to say and so much to share, but now is not the time....He has had a bit of an upset tummy and we are working on resolving this issue.
11/11 - We brought Dougal home on Sunday and everything was ok and all very very exciting...but small problems started occuring...
and now...
Now I am pretty scared...and I hate this...
His interest in his pellets, hay, and now it seems like his water are decreasing...the poops are getting stuck in everything and actually smell bad now.
We are going now to get a weight on him..and pick up some pedialyte.
Following the advice of some great people...
Breeder did say he was treated for cocci...already..
So I guess I am asking...for everyone to please pray for him...think good thoughts...
I do not think we could take losing him too..this quick...all too much..
11/12 - Dougal likes oats...his breeder said try some...so we did. Wonderful woman...she really cares and is upset he is under the weather....called the other buns from his litter to see if anyone else was having problems...just us...I am hoping it was stress is all...
Weebles wobble...he wobbled lol...trying to clean his ears..
I am feeling better about things...I am going to be watching closely...he will be going to the vet on Friday...but I feel that everything will settle down..
and can you believe my 9 week old baby is only 4.3 pounds!!
11/12- The pellets I laid down he really did not touch...loved the oats..and will pick through the pumpkin or pellets..to eat every last one.
I decided to go ahead and give the C.C. again this morning at like 9:30am my time...He likes it well enough and ate all of it really without issue...lifting his head to try to get more out of the syringe etc..
Gave him the Bene bac...the gas drops...
It does not look to me, like he really ate any of his hay over the night...
I did however find that cecals were smushed into his belly and butt fur...I used a wire brush to get them out...wasnt too bad of a fight...and the crusted over chin of his from last nights feeding.
He is still ignoring his pellets, barely nibbles at the hay...Gave him some oat hay...same story.
So we all sorta napped after this morning..Lina stayed up but snuggled in here, in my bed. She said he never left his box..
I have since removed the box...hoping it would encourage him to move about..and it did for a moment or two...he shifted shelves and is now on the lower one...
Which I have been thinking of taking out completely as he pees all over it and not even in the corners...and only this shelf..
No new poops really..a few scattered tiny tiny ones..
Dougal was laying in his litter pan when 4:30 came....grabbed him up anf fed 30cc of the C.C. to him...he fought me some...
When all was done...he walked around pushing my hands and legs but not for pets...felt more like a get away woman ..nudge,,...
Since...that he has curled up on my chest, held in a towel.....and does not seem to care about anything...I have been sneezing and blowing my nose..he doesnt even flinch...at one point he was sitting strange with his ears straight down his back...
He has stopped eating oats, pellets, and the hay now it seems too...
I can hear him nashing his teeth...he is right next to my ear...
I hear tummy noises, but nothing that sounds alarming..
poop an pee ??
His skin/fur tell me he is hydrated for the moment...
His eyes are closed.,..he doesnt seem to want to move...
and of course right when I typed that he got up walked around to my legs and did a dead bunny flop right against my thigh...
11/13 - ok...so tonight I made Dougal come out of my room and spend time with us in the living room...he was glued to me...and at one point when I said enough (as I was trying to eat my dinner) he huffed away and went into his/my/our bedroom and laid down in his litter pan...fine...
He has indeed been peeing all over the lower shelf...and so I did remove it...now there sits this LONG litter pan where the shelf was...he can however get back up to the second level as I left a "step"....
Decided to take a bath..and dumped some more hay into his pans..I sorta shoved it in his face in a hope that he would get annoyed and go to move it and in doing so decide to eat it...it worked and it didnt...He checked out and munched a bit of the organic meadow hay and ignored the timothy...ok...least he nibbled...
All poop seems to have ceased...cecals and all...I see nothing..that scares me...
Had a thought as I cleaned a litter pan...could he have ingested some of the yesterday news litter? If so, what exactly could it do...it is something I thought of to ask the vet today...when we go in 9 hours...
I fed him at 4:30 and again at 12:30am...but I dropped 30ml to 10ml...
If I am feeding him and pushing fluids...why would he need to bother to do it for himself..I am hoping he will get hungry enough to take a look at least at the buffet he has laying around...
After I gave the 10ml of CC..which smells like warmed up apples...I thought..what if I take his pellets, drop warm water onto them making them soft...sprinkly the Critical Care on top..since he seems to like it so very much..and maybe like trick him into eating it..getting him to think it is the same thing...as he did look like he wanted more then what I gave him..
He took one sniff...ONE...and walked away...BRAT!
He proceeded to lay out all over my bed as if it was put here for the sole purpose for his comfort...
I still cant help to smile..
Dougal...started munching his hay again...I have noticed he by passes the greener ones and goes for, lighter colored pieces....
11/13- 9am
Went to sleep late....after feeding the baby boy..and messing around here on RO...
I randomly slightly woke up here and there when would feel Dougal throw himself against my thighs...It would seem he loves to lay at the end of the bed by my feet or legs...Any time I would open my eyes he was there...
Alarm goes off...Scares the crap out of him...and he takes off like he can fly...I felt bad...
So I sit up and put my hand down....um...ICK...Well the cecals have returned....lots of little piles here and there...but this one I stuck my hand in...I do not know what it was, but pure mush and nasty smelling...FUN ...I was pretty glad I had beach towels spread out all over my bed...even though he did actually pee on my blankets last night....so now I have an naked bed while everything washes...
Dougal never did eat any of that mix I tried for him...or even the plain pellets...
This morning though he spent a little time eating his hay...the organic meadow one....and I did see him drinking..
Oddly ...there are no regular poops...where the heck are they? If there are cecals I would assume he is not blocked? so why is he not pooping anything else at all?
He was do for a feeding about an hour ago...but I have let it come and go without feeding him..It seemed to me he started liking it too much...I didnt even have to hold him last time...he chased me onto the bed when he smelled it and sat there pretty as you please eating and reaching for the syringe....and looking for more when it was gone....hmmm....
Dumped all the pellets that were out...oats too...and put down a small bit of fresh pellets.. Got his carrier ready...put a blanket in it and some hay...he has walked on it, over it, in it a few times checking things out...but being a good boy for the most part....
Would seem since I took down the low shelf...he will not go on the higher shelf...
I suppose that is all for now...
11/13-6pm
Now on to Dougal...
My poor boy!!! He was 4.3lbs on Wed at 5:30 pm, by Friday at 10:30am he is now..3.54
That scared the crap out me...
Then the doc comes in talking about a doughy tummy, wants to keep him and do all sorts of stuff talking over 400 bucks...my heart drops thinking I just cant do that!
Fecal comes back and she says it is filled,...LOADED with cocci...I asked if they would allow the subQ fluids to come home with me and let me do it, as that would be much cheaper then letting him stay there...an 80 dollar difference...
If I had all the money in the world I would have done everything and anything they wanted..but I have to live in real life...even when it is scary as death...
So push comes to shove and what we have is a little boy off his food and hay, has some GI Stasis going on, with concern about toxic build ups, and what the Cocci is doing to him...
What is coming out...no form to it at all now...
They treated him with everything about noon...and sent us on our way...
He is getting CC every 4 hours until he starts eating on his own again.
1 gram of bene bac, 1 gram of bio sponge every day.
40ml of Sodium Chloride Fluid two times a day.
0.8 of Albon every day
and for pain, Meloxicam 0.2 once a day.
and pedialyte....
He ate 40cc of CC earlier..stayed with me for a time huddled and sleeping I suppose, in a blanket for awhile, right next to me..so I kicked on the TV as I could not move and what was on?? Howard the Duck..Holy crap...is that one old...Could not believe my eyes lol...
So my daughter comes home and I explain what is going on, what needs to be done and what I expect of her...of course she gets upset and says she does not want him to die..neither do I, I said to her...
She has been helping to get things done, clean and disinfect.
He jumped down after a bit, right before I got a call lol..and went to sit in the corner...where he seemed to be pushing his butt into the corner panel of his cage..
:cry4::dunno
He is still ignoring his food dish and water bowl...but eats a piece of hay every once in a while..
We feed again at 8 )2 hours away) and do the SubQ at 9..
He has gone through a lot and his body is going through a lot and I hope that is all there is to his behaviors now...
Looking forward to seeing him feel better and perhaps share a binky and a kiss with me again..
11/14 -
So last night I was nothing but a puddle of shaking nerves after everything was said and done...I fell asleep before midnight came so he missed out on that feeding...I also over slept and did not get up until 9am...
I was just so exhausted...I woke up though to the sound of chewing....
Dougal was running around his cage, munching on hays...peeing all over the place...like standing in the litter pans but hanging his rear over the edge and I swear it looked like on purpose...All 3 corners of the cage he will pee in, even off the shelves.....Been thinking what will he do if I make his cage into a circle AH HA! But any way...
He seemed so much better that I just sat here watching him for a bit wondering if I should feed the CC and give the SubQ...but I realised that though he is feeling better, he is not all better...and he also was not eating those pellets still...So against my protesting nerves...sigh....I went ahead and made up the CC, 20ml....gave the bio sponge...which FYI is HARD as heck to get out of the tube! Gave the Bene Bac, Gas drops just in case...and backed off for a few...Then gave the pain meds and waited a bit before I went ahead with another round of the SubQ....
Now see I know from working in an animal hospital you do not want to reuse a needle over and over because every time you puncture...it gets a little more dull.
Now if only Dougal understood that!!!!!
He fought me every step of the way this morning...feeding, meds...and with the subQ he was worse then yesterday and while I was not calm..I was calmer!
I think I had to poke him...lord...4-5 times at least. I managed to hold onto him during the end and even though I was worried I might be hurting him I could see no other way to hold him and get the fluids in...Well we got it done!
Now he has this little white crock he likes to drink from...it was actually meant for creme burle or however you spell it...it was bone dry this morning...it is maybe a cup total. He has oat in the rack, orchard in the small pan, timothy on the blanket, orangic meadow in the big pan...I have seen him munch on all but the orchard today...and I swear I hear what sounds like farts coming out of him..(His rear smells something awful!!)
His ears are up today..he is way more active...biting us etc..
I clipped his nails last night because I couldnt take it anymore...I was getting scratched all to hell...him and his baby daggers...There was barely anything to cut and though I tried to be careful I snipped one toenail too far...He bit me for that and well yeah I know it hurt
He has been biting more...just bit Angelina for picking poop up out of his cage...
He is grooming...and like taking a drink and what looks like licking his butt...taking a drink, repeat...he does look a bit frazzled...The sub Q did get all over his back...and while I know he is not getting all of the 40cc's...he is getting most of it,...
I would hate to say we are out of the woods and have something go wrong....but really that is what my gut is telling me...
I am seeing poops of all sorts now...and no cecals...go figure.
He still has smush...but he has solids coming now as well...
11/14 -
We ran out today..few errands...we were gone awhile...Got back in the door..and it did look like he had pushed his pellets around some...but his water looked untouched..
I am hearing VERY loud noises coming from him at random times. I have resumed the gas drops just in case..and while I am NO bun expert...his stomach seems too round, and out...
I fed him once again...got 30cc down with a fight...
I feed
http://www.mannapro.com/rabbit.htm
I wish I had been able to get the mana gro now though being he is go young, but they did not sell it anyway.
Random note...did you know a 50 pound bag of oxbow timothy pellets costs about 78 bucks
The receptionist at the vet was promoted oxbow and trying to get me away from the dark side ya know...but...BA...
Tried the Brome hay with him...same result...nibble nibble..walk away.
Not a whole lot of poo since the first round of clean up this morning..but he is pooing..and that is what is important for the moment....
Those really are some seriously loud tummy noises...hmmm
I got the Albon down him...and was glad I decided to give it at different times, as it would seem...you are not supposed to give it WITH the bio Sponge..which may I add is impossible to give the way it is..you really need to measure it out and stick it in some CC or something...crap is like clay...and even though in his mouth...swallowing it? yeah....
I can see now just how not well he must have been feeling to, if he would not fight about anything...to see just how much a fuss he makes now...
24 hours...made a huge difference...
I put out a 1/4 cup of his pellets..So if he starts eating...I will have an idea how much he got down...
I am hoping he starts eating ok by tomorrow night...doing this and trying to work, get her to school and everything..way stressful...
11/14 -
He has been fighting me harder to not eat the CC...but he is not eating enough pellets...but if I am filling him up on CC why would he eat? How does one walk that fine line?
I am dreading 9pm....du du du dum...SUBQ..no fun...seriously I think I need to take like 4 Klonopins before I try to give him fluids again...I HATE IT!
He has been sitting on his shelf...his butt pressed up to the wall...Have not seen him doing much of anything...brought him out and gave some more gas drops...those noises in the tummy are scaring me...They are so loud..like really loud...like I am 6 feet away and I am like WHAT...was that you? Tried to touch the tum, give a rub...he didnt like that...bit at me...bugger...but when I started petting him he started licking my sweater lol...
Angelina said she saw him at his pellets earlier...we are seeing more and more solid poos...some smushy stuff still..but not nasty smushy or smelly..
SCREAMS! I HATE HATE HATE when I lose my connection and everything I typed...
He has been eating from his dish so I think I am going to skip the 8pm feed...
One of the last things I had typed a minute ago was I wish I would see him eating more of his hay...and he just jumped into the litter pan and started munching...perhaps they can not just understand you when you speak..lmao
This is the Bun hut...
http://www.oxbowanimalhealth.com/products/type/detail?object=1593
I am giving 80cc of fluids per day...leaves him what...60 to make up on his own? I am hoping things perk up...
I hate having to fight him with all this...SO NOT FUN...and being 15 pounds...lord.
(He peed in the pan!)
He did this wiggle jiggle thing up on the shelf...he was drinking and grooming..which is funny cause he totters when he trys to clean his ears...anyway he did this thing that reminds me of a dog shaking off water and he has this cute poofy fluff tail..rather long..It was super cute! He bun flopped on the floor
I have seen that sort of tude...like Zeus...when I am sleeping and catch him on my bed he dashes off my bed like it wasnt him, he wasnt there look lol...I think Dougal would like something cushy and snuggly like a foofy dog bed...seeing as how much he likes MY bed...
Though he avoids it more then he wants to jump on it...cant blame the poor guy at this point...
I do tell him no firmly and push his head down when he bites me...I let him have at the blankets when he gets like that...but I have told Lina she needs to tell him a firm no and push his head down gently...I am afraid she could hurt him...and so I push for her doing the firm no...over anything else...yet I think a lot of this is the meds being pushed on him...Though I know he needs to learn..no matter what he cant bite..
got every thing out, all ready to go and he starts eating his hay...so I think, I will wait till he stops...but he comes down to his pellets and starts eating those...and so I think...I will wait till he is done with those...but he goes and flops ever so cutely on the floor in the corner and I did not have the heart to grab him for the subQ....
I do not want him thinking any time we are around, or he comes down to eat his pellets or hay, hangs out on the floor that something bad will happen...
Angelina is laying on the floor in his pen and he is sitting on her back sniffing her out..and looking up at me
I have noticed he is rather clumsy on the whole...he will miss when he jumps, pretty much almost fall over when he cleans his ears..and some other stuff...I keep thinking it is cause he is a baby..but I do not recall Simon having such problems when he was a baby with us...
And he jumped in the pan to eat more hay!!
I am so freakin torn about how and when to handle this...
I want to encourage and not scare him to never come off his top shelf again...
Until I pulled out the needles and fluid...he had been just chillin on his shelf....
11/15
Dougal is definitely a morning boy...which goes against my very nature lol...
You can hear him running up and down...eating, jumping, munching hay...but when you turn to look he goes and lays down...like he is hiding lol.
I woke up to find his water dish bone dry and his food bowl the same. The water dish holdsa half cup of water! I am not doing SubQ this morning. I am also not Feeding the CC except to get the meds down.
I refilled the water and the food and added some oats which he was most happy to have.
Last night went ok with the fluids. I only had to stick him once and he only tried to escape twice...which he was not able to.I tried to give a bit of oats from my hand as a peace offering...well he ate them, but he bites to pick up...Simon used to lick anything in your hand...
I very much think we are on the mend! Everything is going to be great!
I made of some CC and squirted the right amount of the bio-sponge in it, added a little more CC and then the Bene Bac...why not get it all is one shot right? So that is two grams of meds, with the CC, made of a full 10cc of it all...He also had his pain meds too..but I am wondering if we really need to continue them..Later on he will get his Albon...Which is at about 4pm I think we will do...You are not supposed to give the Bio-Sponge with anything...
I am beginning to think the organic meadow hay is his favorite. He munches that one the most out of them all.
I brought the water dish and most of the hay down off the shelf now...seeing as he feels better I see no reason why he can not come down to eat and drink. I only left it up there because he was sick and I wanted him to have easy access to encourage.. His litter pans...I use my hands and grab out the wet litter, all the poops and old hay...I sanitize my hands and then put new litter and hay in the pans...He seems to have really picked up peeing in the pans! He did pee on my bed again today though...it was not a lot so I am thinking it is a marking thing...My bed is right next to his cage....
I have decided to rearrange it some and make it more fitting for him...that step is too short a space for him...need to make things easier to come and go from without hurting himself...
His poops are back still...some are pretty darn dark...would even go as far as to say black...but he is pooping! No where near as much squashy poo today as well...however his rear still stinks something awful...
I will watch and wait...see how he eats and drinks by 8pm....and if he is ok...I will not feed or SubQ him...should he eat nothing and drink nothing I will go ahead with both...but I do not think that will happen.
He has been eating...He also did have like...8cc maybe of the CC earlier becauseI put two meds in it...so I am assuming that tamped down his urge to eat a bit...but he has nibbled a time or two...He has been chewing a fair amount of hay today...
Only found one pile of cecals and they looked much better than what I had been seeing...
(He is eating whats left of the oats...only gave him a bit
I put down a kitty pan...the two sided plastic dish...a bit of oat in one side, pellets in the other...His cup however is full...untouched since it was filled at like 9am...
What do you think...if it stays full until like 8pm tonight...(5 hours from now)...should I go ahead and give the SubQ again?
Last night was not as bad as the other times...and I also stopped using the back of the neck like they showed me..and used more in the middle of his back how I learned years ago...he was much calmer...I think it hurt less...and I am sure that skin around his neck has to be sore as heck now..
11/16
Woke up to a noisy bunny! He really seems to like mornings lol...He quiets down once we all get up, stand up etc.
Lots o poo in the pen! Nice spot in the litter pan...was happy to see that pile. He ate all of the alfalfa hay I had put out last night, drank a 1/4 cup of water from what I could tell....I had also put another 1/4 cup of pellets in the dish...so that would be like a 1/2 of cup total I suppose he ate yesterday/this morning. I filled both sides of the dish with 1/4 cup of pellets sprinkled with oats before I left and refilled his water.
He was none to pleased with me giving the meds again today...but we got it done. I will give the Albon again this evening and watch to see how he drinks for the rest of the day...I will give him till 8pm tonight again...if nothing has really been drunk I will do SubQ again...
Angelina said he did a binky this morning but I did not see it. I let him out into the living room while I got the CC ready that I put the Bio Sponge into....He only stayed out for a few minutes. I wish I had been able to catch the binky.....
11/17
I noticed last night he had started drinking..and that his water needed a refill this morning as well. He has been eating any where from 1/4-1/2 cup of pellets a day...and some oats.
He managed last night to get up on my bed...leave tons of poop and pee too. I was out in the living room at the time on the phone. I am still trying to figure if he jumped the two high NIC or got around it some how...
Lina is cleaning up the poop and there are tons of little ones all over, and two piles of cecals...none look too squishy. He is still is peeing every where.
I suppose I am not so good at potty training. I would love see Dougal catch on and never poop or pee any where but his pans...I have been considering moving his pen into the living room making it more secure...Then I will not have to worry about him getting under my stuff or on the bed.....or jumping out. I have this feeling I am going to have to close the top up..not leave it open anymore...
Since he is feeling better....he has much more tude...DOES NOT like me, but is licking Angelina, butting her, jumping in her lap, cleaning her hair
He runs from me...I would run from me too though if I was him...
11/21
Dougal had seemed to very much be improving...even his potty habits started getting better when we shrank down to the dog crate and took him out of the palace.
He has been fighting me about taking the Bio-Sponge however...and it has gotten to the point where none of it is getting into him. He simply will no longer swallow it. No matter what I try, what I put it in or not, he will not swallow or eat it. He will eat the Bene and Albon no problem however. Can not say I blame the little guy, the stuff really is like sculpting clay...
His pen was a mess this morning...the smush has returned and he has stopped eating his cecals again as of yesterday...I am concerned about him, his attitude and behaviors...
he is biting at anything he does not like regardless of how you try to correct him...he does not listen. I constantly wonder how he manages to get poop only in the large water dish but not the small white one.
He will eat oats no problem...but he is starting to slack with the pellets again...and his drinking is again a concern to me.
I opened the other Bene Bac today...the other one was done. Not much left of the first CC package I opened for this...but I do have another one of those as well. I am glad I have both and that we still have SubQ left...We just may end up needing it.
I keep thinking I need to go back to work for a Vet...so I can get discounts on these things...The needles and Fluid I could get at least...
He has been poopy, stinky...and sorta lazy today.
Last night he was not all that different but he was running around and doing some binkys. And he only let three poops out onto the carpet. MUCH BETTER!
BUT...I see no real poop today....except for what was in the cage. It took awhile to clean as well because I made my daughter do it. She was up before me and did not bother to even check on him, give him new/fresh/more water...food etc...when this has been a constant conversation...
Even last night we were talking about Simon and how she felt it was her fault he died because she was not pulling her weight...We talked about how it did not matter what she did or did not do...as I was taking care of him...and it did not matter he would have passed on either way....
I am nervous with Dougal on many levels...
This illness we seem unable to shake...
Dougal seems unable to sit, but has to FLOP! The boy is a flopping fool...8 out of 10 times...if he goes to lay down, he throws himself down...it is quite entertaining to be honest.
He tried to be spider bunny when we were cleaning the crate....but I was smart enough to have those buggers be 3 high...though I felt bad turning to see him fall back to the ground...I always worry a bun will hurt themselves with that sort of fall. I kept the NIC cubes connected and keep them for a pen when we need it...
Honestly though I am really rather quite concerned...I suppose he reinfected himself with the cocci again...but we have been doing all the meds as we are supposed to...how is it this started all over again?
11/22
Well Dougal has decided he likes eating my carpet. Try to stop him butshort of keeping him in the pen all day every day I dont know how to stop him. We try yelling, stomping, water bottle...does not phase him in the least.
Still having smushy poo...but he eat a fair amount over the night and morning....but I am still concerned about his water intake...I have started spiking his water with white grape juice....everything new to him...he does not seem to want or even smell, try etc.
I did not give the Bio-Sponge today...it was such a nightmare yesterday and today would have been the last day anyway,....He just will not swallow it no matter what I do, how I try to trick him
With the smushy poo I wonder should I continue the Bene.....Today was supposed to be the last day for that...
Random... (god bless brown paper bags)....
Yeah I know...but we have been pretty on top of things except for him eating the cecals....
He started the Albon on Nov 13 and has been, and will get it till Nov 26.
I am hoping things get out of his system by then.
am considering either trying to force him to drink via syringe...but leaning towards the SubQ...because I know that will actually get into him...but man I know he will struggle and fight me to death about it.
I am concerned about his lack of water intake...
Yet he is eating with no issues again today...
11/22 4pm
He still has the runs coming...he has not really drank any of the water since he was cleaned up today...WORRIED!
11/23
He drank well enough and ate good over the night...
CLeaned up, dumped his litter, refreshed everything...walked away for a minute and boom...skids everywhere on the brown paper bags....
I am worried about this...
Is it possible for a bun to be unable to kick the Cocci even with meds?
11/24 -
Well lets see hmmmm.
Smushy poo today, but it seems to have a pattern, odd as that may seem..
Dougal has started again with the runs...not just icky cecals, but the actual runs...not total liquid, but getting close. Only seems to hit at certain times of the day...Like after 8am and on....till the afternoon ish...
Started back 3 days ago.
His drinking has slacked off along with his eating...BUT
He will eat any and all oats you give him...He will drink some water when I add the white grape juice to it...and today he seems to be eating and drinking better...
I am concerned the cocci has come back...could it be he has some sort of tolerance to the Albon?
It is like it got better and still came back. He has been on the Albon since we went to the vet on the 13 and his last dose is the 26th...
I am unsure what to think....
wanted to start themix of mana, wheat germ, oats..and maybe something I am forgetting...
I had been thinking of trying to buy it all and start giving it to him to help make sure he is gaining enough weight...but I am not sure I should now.
I have been boiling any water he gets...and of course letting it cool before he gets it...
We have been cleaning and changing his pans...scooping out poop when we see it...Using hand sanatizer etc...
Had to take out the carpet because we have noticed he is picking up strands and eating them....so we rolled it up and have it sitting in Angelina room for now...sigh...
--
After chatting withCathy/BlueGiants...
I decided to ditch the oxbow hays and try for a fresh bale. I was able to find one place that is an ok drive to get to...A compressed 50lb bale of timothy/alfalfa hay...cost only like 12 bucks! Picked up the probiotic stuff for horses...it is like double the amount and more then less then half the cost...awesome...the calf mana they said whenthey have it even cheaper then at the tractor supply store. HE was also trying to talk me into starting a pellet they sell..
yeah..all good and well but I can not even get hisstomach settled on the rather plain diet he is already on...not going togo changing his pellets right now....I do not think I will period...unless something health related makes a difference with that choice.
Stopping everything except the bene....
He has been coming and going from the hay...which is more than I could say before..
The Brome did smell like vinegar..made me wonder...
Makes me wonder about all oxbow products really...
---------
The poopies have been irregular again since this started, but a good amount of them are uniform, round, firm...
He is being picky with the hays again...one minute he will eat the brome and the next he will not go near it...we have 5 kinds and I keep switching a bit to keep his interest..
I had been giving - Welchs, 100% White Grape Juice, from concentrate with added ingredients. - No Sugar Added - 120% Vitamin C
Says on label - total fat 0, sodium 1%, Total Carb 13% with this listed with it -Sugars 38g**, Protein 0g
The ** says contains natural fruit sugars only
No Artifical flavors or colors added.
Says it is easier on young stomachs than apple juice.
I did stop the SubQ, but I could start it again if we have to. I do have the supplies left for at least a few days more...maybe 3? Could possibly pick up more if needed...
I stopped the Bio Sponge...so he missed one dose yesterday...I just could not get it into him any more...he started spitting it back out, not swallowing etc a few days ago...no matter what I put it in or tried to do.
I Gave him more Bene Bac today just cause...but that was supposed to end yesterday too.
The pain meds we stopped awhile ago, but I might have a day or two.
LOL- I never bothered to smell it before, but yeah it smells like cake batter...We have a bunch left for now..supposed to stop that on Thursday.
He has had nothing at all since he came to us except for the pellets, oxbows hays, and the generic brand of Oats from Walmart I think it might be...Not the instant kind.
No carrots, greens, not even the papaya tablets...Since we have not been able to achieve a healthy norm without meds I was not going to try anything new....
Every thing was exactly the same when it went from 1 day to the next and everything went to smush again. Nothing had changed at that time...I started adding the WHite Grape to the water when I saw he was slacking off...he tends to pass it up really though...odd boy that he is...and it is very very diluted...like maybe...1cc? to a little more then a half of cup of boiled water...
So yeah I am stopping the Albon for now..giving his system a rest....and the White Grape...already took it away..and just the plain boiled water for him...
This is the site I found on the new hay we are trying out..
http://www.standleehay.com/home.aspx
His poos have seemed normal for awhile now.
He was acting slightly strange earlier,...running and hiding from us...but he stopped.
Any time he knows we are in his cage he tends to get upset...he will nudge you and push..jump back in and get right in your way...lol
He made cleaning and disinfecting everything again today quite a chore.
This cage attitude he has worries me slightly for when he is older...maybe he will grow out of it.
Angelina and Dougal are bonding well to eachother...it helped he starting licking her now...she feels so relieved and happy. Awesome what a bunny can do...
He will come up to the couch, but only stays a minute..he did flop right against the couch on the floor, right below where my head/hands were....I thought that was sweet of him.
I used the vanodine my friend sent me today to clean up everything...though now I am totally out of litter...BAH!
Well...we have hay to last quite some time..(please please please eat it a lot) and a pellet he is eating REALLY well...a cup or more, maybe up to 2 cups per day on an awesome day...now I just need to stock on litter and we should be good...unless his health takes a dip...
It is so green right? I was like wow this cant be real lol...So used to oxbow crap and man it seems like crap now compared to how fresh this seems (and smells from a distance)
ok...I just hope it stays playful...
He has actually been out since like about noon-ish...about 5 almost now..he has been hanging out at the edge where the carpet goes to hardwood...we have a nic fence and litter pan over there...kind behind my glider chair...he has been back in there almost all day..but ok.
He has come out to play...keeps trying to eat Angelina's letters to her Family in NY....lol I warned her though not to let him actually get at any of it...the pencils, the pink erasers etc...
Well already the poop seems to be improving...lots of cecal piles thatcould have become hay pattys if we had not cleaned up..but it is not smushy as before...he does have that stinky smell following though...keep joking we should have named him Stinky Butt instead of Dougal lol...
Trying the Vanilla in the water but he turned his nose at it...so oh well...we will see what the next day or so brings...
