Diamond needs help! Poopy butt :(

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treasuresandstuff

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2010
Messages
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Location
Clinton, Missouri, USA
IMMEDIATE INFORMATION:


Location: Clinton, MO

Description (Breed, color, weight) Doublemaned Lionhead, white, roughly 2lbs

Age 9 weeks

Sex Female

Concise Summary of the Rabbit's Condition: Acting normal, hopping, playing, asking for
cuddles, eating fewer pellets than normal, loose unformed poos sticking to back end and feet
not runny. Ran out of hay midday Sat, so has had no hay for roughly 1.5 days.



ADDITIONAL INFORMATION / CHECK LIST: (Please fill in relevant info).

Fecal and Urinary Output

- are the bunny's poops and pees normal? Normal water intake and pee, no poos since
mid-day yesterday except a few loose unformed ones sticking to the rump and feet.
- when did they last use their litterbox? Peed an hour ago
- any unusual behavior? straining to pee? unusual litter habits? Nothing seems unusual
except the lack of formed poos.
- what litter and/or bedding do you use? Currently half towel and half pelleted wood,
there was cat litter in the cage when we got her but most has been removed. Trying to get
her and the other rabbit in wire bottom cage with rest spots to limit actual time on the wire.


Medical History

- spayed/neutered? no
- has s/he been to the vet or been sick before? unknown, only had for one week.
- is s/he on any medications? no. Considering giving some of that stuff you give cats
to prevent hair balls.

Diet

- what specifically does your bunny eat? Purina show pellets an hay (prefer timothy but whatever I can buy)
- when and what did s/he eat last? Food offered this morning, was not interested for
about an hour, has only eaten half the ration. She gets 1/8 cup pellets in the am and again
in the pm.
- any changes in the way s/he eats? (ie: not eating a particular food, odd chewing motions, etc)
She did not eat right off like usual, and when she did she chewed slow and kinda deliberately.


Other

- movement - any unusual movements? Is s/he hopping normally? She falls asleep sitting up
then her feet slip out from under her waking her up. I am not sure if this is normal or
new.
- is the rabbit molting? Yes, began Saturday, same day we ran out of hay.
- any weight loss? Not that I can tell, we are watching her.
- any sign of drooling? wet face? Her nose was wet the first threee days we had her but
it seemed to clear up, Nose is dry now.
- runny eyes? No, but considering trimming face fur as conceals eyes almost completely.
- wet nose? coughing? sneezing? No to all.
- is s/he breathing normally Yes, occassionally seems to heave a sigh, but its
like maybe once or twice an hour and done after shifting where she is laying.

Additional

- any plants, chocolate or other substances within reach? No, but she is 3 feet from an air vent
should we move her cage?
- has the rabbit been outdoors? Only while we were at the swap we got her at about a week ago
- any other pets? if so, have they been ill? Yes, 3 mice-lost one male to a fight with
female, not ill. 2 gerbils-appear healthy. 5 corn snakes, all healthy and kept away from
the rabbits and other prey type animals. 2 ferrets kept well away from the rabbits and I tend
the rabbits before the ferrets so they do not smell them on me.


It seems it may be tied in with the lack of hay? I am trying to raise the money
to buy more (we do not get paid until next monday) but so far no good. I did manage to sell
one thing but the money won't be on my prepaid visa until Friday! I'm at a loss of what to do.
Ihave access to fresh grass, clover, and plantain. I have some spinach, bok choi, and
apples, but I read rabbits should not have fresh foods until 6 months old?
She did accidentally get some of Burnie's salad yesterday. Could this be the cause?

Note: She did test negative for whatever is looked at in a fecal and for mites.
 
The best thing to do is feedgrass and some dandelions if there wasno fertilizer applied. Make sure she gets plenty of water. No fruits and vegetables.
 
She really needs to be on only a hay and water diet. Grass might be an OK substitute for hay, but it's not great. When young bunnies get diarrhea and are lethargic, like is sounds like she is, they can be pretty badly off. Usually if someone with a bunny under 6 mo comes here with a diarrhea issue, and/or lethargy, I tell them it is an emergency vet situation. I know you can't afford that at the moment, but I want to stress how serious this could be. Can you borrow any hay from a neighbor or friend for a few days? You will need to keep her hydrated and provide lots of fiber. Canned pumpkin puree can be an ok source of fiber for diarrhea, and pedialyte is optimal to get her rehydrated. The lethargy is usually from dehydration or bacterial toxins in the bloodstream. Literally, when the young ones get diarrhea like this, they can die within 12-24 hours due to dehydration and bacterial toxins. The bacteria in the GI tract of a young rabbit are not very stable and any change in diet can really upset the balance of good and bad. Then the bad bacteria take over, and cause diarrhea and release toxins into the body.

I don't want to be too harsh, but she really needs help and you may want to consider giving her to someone who can help her, like a rescue or shelter. If she's not so lethargic anymore, she may be recovering, and then it's not so urgent.
 
tonyshuman wrote:
She really needs to be on only a hay and water diet. Grass might be an OK substitute for hay, but it's not great. When young bunnies get diarrhea and are lethargic, like is sounds like she is, they can be pretty badly off.

I know you want to help and appreciate it, but the only thing off is that she isn't pooping normal. She is just as active, in fact when I gave her a huge pile of grass she did a little hop dance. She is drinking and peeing normal too. I never said she was lethargic, the odd way of falling asleep sitting up is something she has always done with me, I got little to no info from the breeder. I do not understand the directions to give her away, she is not dehydrated or have diarrhea its more like its just those "c" poos that they usually eat without any of the dry hard ones. Its not runny at all. I know you don't mean to be harsh but really, you put it way out of context.

Quick update on the hay issue. I have worked out a deal with a lady, she will buy me hay in the morning and when my clutch of corn snake eggs hatch she gets her pick. Or my ghost corn snake. Whichever she likes better. So I should have 3 square bales of hay in the morning. Straw if the feed shop is out of hay.

I am wondering if she is getting enough pellets or should I not feed pellets until her droppings are normal again?

She dug right into the grass which I think is good. Should I clip where the poo is or do you think I can soak her bum to get it off? I would like to avoid clipping the fur on the bottoms of her feet if possible.

I just can't believe I am being told to give her up so quickly and abruptly. I know poopy butt is not good, but its not runny, she is not dehydrated and she is active. My gracious!

As upset as that makes me I really honestly appreciate all advice and will keep it all in mind especially if this hay agreement falls through.
 
Sorry, I took your statement that she was falling asleep while sitting up to mean that she was lethargic. From the initial info you told us it sounded like she was behaving differently, as well as having runny poos.
 
That's ok, I know when someone is worried things can be written and read wrong. That is why I tried to keep my response as neutral as possible and to be sure I was clear that I do appreciate the advice. No, the falling asleep she has always done that is why I was not sure if it was new or not, I got very little info on how she was prior to my getting her from the person I got her from. And since I have only had her about a week, if it started with us then technically it would be "new" behavior right? I do hope you know I meant no malice in my response. Thank you so much for your info.

Do you really think I should take away pellets for a while? I want to be sure she is fed exactly as is best for the situation. As I said I should have hay in the morning.
 
If the poos mashed to her bum are cecal poos, the ones that are supposed to be eaten, you should continue to feed her. Make sure she is well-hydrated, which should really help her produce some normal fecal poos. I would guess that she's producing cecals but not fecals because there is so little fiber in her system, so try to get her to eat some grass. Not eating all the cecals is pretty normal for a young bunny--the only abnormal thing here would then be that she's not producing fecals, and you want to get her to eat anything to increase motility through her GI tract. I wouldn't take the pellets away if they are mushed cecal poos. Also, refill her water bowl and bottle and make sure she drinks some of it. If she won't, force feed her 10mL if you can.

If the mushy poos might be fecals (I would do a smell test, as gross as it sounds--cecals smell like onions and fecals smell like death), take the pellets away. They contain carbs and protein that make the bad GI bacteria grow. Then you'd want her on a hay (or grass) and water diet only.

If you have any probiotic (Bene-Bac, ProBios, human acidophilus CAPSULES not yogurt), give her some of that as well. Do not use the cat laxative. The cat laxative is oily and impedes the rehydration of food that's stuck in the GI tract, and getting water into the food in the GI tract is the best thing you can do to get it moving again.
 
I did not know that about the cat lax stuff. I won't use it! I just made arrangements so that no matter what I will have hay tomorrow. She is busy munching grass right now. She has her eyes shut and looks so cute! I swear its like a kid with potato chips for the first time in weeks, lol! Like she is saying YUM! with her face. Now and then she shakes her but and does a little jump. I think the grass made her happy.

Ok that was nasty. I went and sniffed a spot on her bum I need to clean and will do after I am done typing. It smelled mostly like onion but was obviously poo (ick!) poo just has an odd smell. I would not say I smelled death but it was not completely oniony either. I will take away pellets for two days and see how she does. Her poo should be normal again before I give them back right? How long should they be normal before I give back pellets and how much pellets should I give, how often? I don't want to rush her system and have a relapse.
 
Man, I had posted on Craigslist that I needed hay and what I was willing to trade and stuff in order to get it and got a really odd email that confused me. Person claims to have raised rabbits 23 years. They basically said I am feeding TOO much HAY (is that even possible?) and that THAT is what is making my rabbit have bad poos. That I need to give LOTS of pellets and hay only 2 times a WEEK. NO veggies for ANY rabbit EVER.

Um, none of that sounds right to me? Especially for these kinds of rabbits? Also told me to put them on PINE bedding???
 
I would keep the pellets away until she's got normal poos, glad she likes the grass! They should clear up within 2-3 days.

Yes, none of what that person on CL said makes sense.
 
Thanks. I sold one of my corn snakes so I can get hay for sure no matter what. They will be here for her (the snake) just before the feed shop opens. I will wait until about noon before buying any just to give the other person a chance to. If I don't have to spend the money on hay I can spend it on other things we are in need of. Like the wire to finish Diamond's cage and to make a better one for Burnie. Fingers are crossed and than you for all the advice.
 
So I should have 3 square bales of hay in the morning. Straw if the feed shop is out of hay.

No straw. It does not have the nutrients as hay. Besides the rabbit won't eat it. Straw is good for insulation or the litter box, but not for food.

If you are really stuck for hay, try asking the shelter or a rescue center if they could spare some hay for you.
 
I find it funny when people say rabbits won't eat straw. Its great for fiber but no extra calories. I learned this from an alpaca breeder. If they are on a really good diet otherwise the extra calories in hay can upset the balance so some rabbits need the empty fiber from straw. If that makes sense. When I raised satin angoras I fed straw and they all ate it and none got over weight which was a problem I was trying to breed out of the lines I got into originally. Of course you have to really know what you are doing. I keep forgetting that I never mentioned I was old hat to rabbits. Thank you for the post though, this way newbies to rabbits don't go and get straw thinking it works the same as hay. Honestly I have never had a rabbit that would not eat straw the same as hay. Again thank you!
 
I get different types of hay for my friends and other breeders from a hayfarm.
One breeder asks for a few bales of straw because it is cheaper, to line her litter boxes. Her rabbits may nibble on it, but she says they don't eat it.

1149_152128_360000000.jpg


Here is the straw that she uses in the nest of Flemish Giants. Picture taken on June 12/2010.
 
I don't know what type of straw we have here, but I could get some from the breeder the next time I see her, and try feeding it to my bunny. :)
 
Pet_Bunny wrote:
I don't know what type of straw we have here,  but I could get some from the breeder the next time I see her,  and try feeding it to my bunny.  :)

It never hurts to try something new :) As long as it is known not to be toxic that is. I did manage to get a bale of Oat straw once and none of them liked it, it got moldy a lot faster than the Barley we usually have. Maybe the rabbits can tell Oat straw isn't that great or something? Plus there is the fact that it can be hard to get them to try something new, at least in my experience. I found it easiest to get them switched by blending it slowly with hay until it was half and half then slowly to all straw. I would not recommend all straw for rabbits not prone to weight issues or breeding stock, unless of course they had weight issues lol:wink
 
My guys LOVE Oat Hay, which has some seed tops, and that may be the difference there.
 

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