Coughing? (Resolved)

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BethM

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Ok, so last year I posted about Nick and his "coughing."

Nick has been a sneezy bunny since the first day he came to live with us. I have always assumed he had allergies. He will sneeze more when he's had his nose in the hay bin, or in a dusty corner. He will occasionally have a "moist" nose, but never any discharge (just moisture that will come out while actually sneezing). He has never had matted fur on his paws.

Last year, I got very concerned, because he started sometimes making a weird noise like a cough. I don't know if bunnies can actually cough or not, but the noise was like a squeaky, wheezy, sneeze.
After he did this a couple times, I took him in to see the vet. The vet did not take a culture, as there was no wet or dry discharge while Nick was there. The vet said Nick seemed quite healthy, other than having a slight congestion. He said the congestion didn't sound serious, but was more congestion than he liked to hear. He sent us home with some Baytril. I think the prescription was for 10 or 14 days, I can't remember. It was the ground up stuff in suspension, I think.
I gave Nick the entire course of Baytril. I know Baytril has sometimes been overused, but none of my rabbits had used it in the 2+ years we've had them. The cough went away completely at that point, and the sneezing was very much reduced.

Since then, Nick's sneezing has gradually been on the increase again. It really got going a month or so ago, when spring trees started blooming. (I was miserable then, too.) In the last few days, the "cough" has returned. He doesn't do it often, maybe two coughs in an evening, close together, but not every evening. He "coughed" tonight, after he was lying on a rug in the bunny condo that is covered with fur.
(Nick is a Holland Lop mix, and has the typical flattened face. He prefers to lie down totally stretched out, with his chin on the ground.)

Nick has been eating normally, and had the same activity level as usual.

The weather has been strange this last week. Cool and rainy alternating with hot. Dry and steamy in the same day. In fact, a huge weather system moved in this afternoon, and I've been slightly dizzy for a few hours. The only thing I can attribute that to is the change in the barometric pressure. the temperature dropped 20 degrees in about 2 hours.

The only other thing that has changed lately is that we switched litter. We were using Feline Pine/ExquisiCat. We switched to Cozy 'n' Fresh, purchased at the Tractor Supply Company. It is a kiln-dried, pelleted pine litter that supposedly has "activated carbon to reduce odor." Made by the same company that makes Equine Fresh. It does smell different than Feline Pine. Their litter box has a built-in grate, so the bunnies never come into actual contact with the litter. (We've been using this for about a month. Nick's sneeze has been on the increase since February.)

Anyway. Should I be rushing him in to the vet?

I plan sifting the pellet food from now on. Also, I will be getting as much fur as possible off of their rugs tomorrow. In about 6 weeks, we are moving out of our terribly dusty apartment with the awful carpet into a house with all wood floors; I am hoping this will help my allergies, and Nick's as well.
 
You know, I don't know. However, at the vet yesterday I mentioned that Muffin has been found to have a very slight heart murmur and the vet asked if she ever coughed or seemed out of breath. She will squeak or snort once in a while as she's inhaling a favorite food, but never cough. Do you think Nick might have shortness of breath? I would assume the vet has listened closely to his heart, however.

It's possible that the seasonal change led to another URI, and not just allergies. I would tend to think that since he's had it before, and it improved with antibiotics, it's just a recurrence of the same infection, previously kept in check by his immune system, and now coming out due to stresses of weather change. It would be best to try to treat it again, but not use Baytril, since the bacteria are very likely to be resistant to it as they have already survived a treatment with it.
 
Did Nick happen to have surgery right before coming to you?

I ask because the Little Bunny had something like you are describing after she was spayed. It ended up being from a med they put up her nose that must have damaged the tissue and took a long time to heal, over a year.
 
The only surgery Nick had was his neuter. He and Amelia were in foster care for about a year before we adopted them, so it had been almost a year since his neuter. After we adopted them, we kept going to the same vet, so I have seen his vet records, and there were no other illnesses or treatments.

At the time we adopted, our HRS group included a free basic exam with the adoption. Nick and Amelia both checked out fine.


 
That was my only idea Beth lol. I do hope you figure it out. I know that has to be frustrating. Good luck
 
Thanks, Claire and Amy.


I guess I will get up early tomorrow and try to get him in to the vet. The clinic opens at 8, but the staff gets there at 7 to take calls. Hopefully I will be able to get an actual appointment. Poor guy gets so stressed out from vet trips, I don't want to take him in as a drop-off.

 
Err on the side of caution. I would take him to the vet.

The second night I had Sawyer he woke me up in the middle of night by what I can only describe as "barking". I couldn't image why my neighbor's dog carrying on. Then I realize it was Sawyer. It was one of the funniest sounds I heard. I felt bad but I couldn't help but laugh. He did have an URI.
 
Keep us update tomorrow when you take him to the vet. I hope they find some answers tomorrow. Are they able to test the mucous in side the nose? I know it was done on the Little Bunny but she wasn't a great vet either. I know this can be painful for them depending on how small they are and the size of the swab they use. Just an idea when you go. I'll be thinking about you guys.

Pla, since I have never heard something resembling a bark from my rabbits that is funny.
 
Thanks, Amy.

I will post what happens tomorrow. If they can't get him a regular appointment tomorrow, or at least let me wait with him, I will try to schedule for Monday evening. (They're open until 8pm on Mondays.)
I really don't think Nick would do well as a drop-off. Going to the vet stresses him out enough as it is. Amelia has to go with him, even though she gets really grumpy, I think it helps him to have her there.

Also, the drop-off costs just as much as the regular appointment, but I don't get to be there with him, and only get a short summary over the phone. My vet is really great, and I trust him, but I would rather be there during the exam.

I don't think Nick likes me much, but at least I'm a familiar presence for him. :p



 
I agree with Cliare that if this ( or something similar )responded to an antibiotic at one point in the past that it is most likely bacterial
I had a bun that as she aged began to get recurring bouts of heavy breathing/wheezing. She was very incomfortable when this occurred soI would always take her to the vet immediately; I was always given baytril in one form or another and thiscleared up about 3-4 times in about 1.5 yr period before the baytrilhad no effect at all.
the vet here eventually gave me zithromax but would not give me the proper dosage for a rabbit ; she improved somewhat on the lowerd dosage of zithromax but did not fully recover until I treated myself with bicillin. I doubtthat your bun is having an allergic response but think that she has a begiining or moderate ( URI in chest )
I would take her to the vet.
My rabbits could not have a culture done as she had no discharge ; the vet would have had to do a tracheal wash which would have been under anesthesia and I couldn't risk that as she was having difficulty breathing anyway.
 
Well, I called my vet this morning as soon as they opened.
Somehow, they don't have either of their exotics vets on staff today. :X
The receptionist said that because they haven't seen Nick since November (when he last was seen for the same symptoms), and there's no exotics vet on staff, they can't even refill the Baytril, much less prescribe zithromax.

Also, since neither vet is on staff, I can't take Nick in to be seen today.

My choice was to take him to a completely different vet that I've never been to, or to wait until Monday.
Since Nick seems in high spirits today, and has been super-active, I made an appointment for Monday. I'll be keeping a close eye on him all weekend.


:(:(:(:(:(
 
angieluv wrote:
That sounds OK ; it doesn't sound like he is in an emergency situation

hope that he remains stable until Mon.
I hope so, too.


:nerves1
 
I am sorry you didn't get to take Nick in. I would have waited like you did. How did he do over the weekend?
 
Thanks for asking, Amy.

Nick seems to be doing ok. He's been eating like a champ, and he was out doing the Bunny 500 around the apartment this morning. I guess he isn't feeling too bad!

If he had been acting like he felt sick, I would have gone ahead and taken him to the other vet. I was very irritated that there would be a day that neither rabbit-savvy vet was on staff.

His appointment is for 6:30 tomorrow evening. Hopefully, the vet will be able to give me something other than Baytril.
 
Hi
Wanted to wish you well with your appointment. If the vet is insistent on baytril ( I am hopeful that you can get zithromax or chloramphenical or Convenia or bicillin ) then at least push for the injectable baytrilwhich works better than orally.
Ihave had to struggle with vets for meds here which is a very difficult task ' I have often not gotten what I asked for. Initially (for my rabbits anyway) the baytril is effective but the respiratory problem reoccurs only becoming more resistant to it.

Ihope that you do better than me :)

just do the best that you can........
 
angieluv wrote:
Hi
Wanted to wish you well with your appointment. If the vet is insistent on baytril ( I am hopeful that you can get zithromax or chloramphenical or Convenia or bicillin ) then at least push for the injectable baytrilwhich works better than orally.
Ihave had to struggle with vets for meds here which is a very difficult task ' I have often not gotten what I asked for. Initially (for my rabbits anyway) the baytril is effective but the respiratory problem reoccurs only becoming more resistant to it.

Ihope that you do better than me :)

just do the best that you can........
Thanks!
If the vet tries to give me oral Baytril again, I am not above dropping the name of my HRS chapter manager to get something different. She has worked very closely with the other rabbit vet at that clinic for many years. I haven't done it in the past, but if that's what it takes to get Nick better meds...... I really don't want this to become a chronic problem.

My HRS friend did tell me last time, Nick should have been given zithromax. I sort of pushed it out of my mind when Nick seemed to get better after the Baytril.

I keep trying to see the more experienced guy, but he's never there when I need to take my bunnies in, so I get the vet with only a couple years experience with rabbits. Overall, he's very good, but, well, inexperienced. I think he's hesitant to try the more aggressive treatments, preferring to start out more cautiously.
(Poor guy, he's allergic to rabbits, and Nick sheds like a madman when he goes in there! He was very good when Nick had stasis, though, even calling me back personally the next day to check on him.)


 
I too would have waited. I hope they can figure out what's going on.
 
I am just back from the vet clinic.

The doctor said Nick's lungs were mostly fine, there was some congestion towards the front of the lungs, but he sounded mostly clear towards the back.
The doctor did want to give Baytril again, reasoning that Nick did respond to it last time, maybe continuing the course of treatment for a week longer than normal. I brought up my concerns about resistance, and asked if the zithromax, or something else, might be appropriate. He said that would be fine, and also mentioned something else, that I don't remember the name of. He said it was in the same class as Baytril, and was being used widely in Europe.

Anyway, he gave me the zithromax, on the condition that if Nick doesn't start showing some improvement fairly quickly, that we switch back to the Baytril. He didn't want Nick to get worse, waiting for the zithromax to work.

So, I've got zithromax in a 2.5% suspension. I am to give 1cc every day for 5 days; then 1cc every other day for 10 days; then 1cc every third day for 6 days. (Nick weighs 4 pounds, 9.5 oz.)
They only had enough on hand to give me half the meds today, and I am to call in when I'm almost out to pick up the rest.


Although I am glad that the doctor was willing to give me the meds I asked for, he always seems a little unsure off himself. He said we could choose between the three meds (Baytril, Zithromax, and the other one I can't remember), and go from there. I wish he had had a bit of a stronger opinion, other than just wanting to fall back on the Baytril again.

 
Whew. At least it's mostly in the front of the lungs andyou got some zithromax. It's too bad your vet isn't too confident in himself treating rabbits. It would also worry me a bit. Hopefully he can learn more and be more confident in his skills.
 

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