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How is your little mystery girl? :) Any news?

Accidents happen, but what is important is thatyou learn fromthem :). I think everyone just gets upset in the spur of the moment kind of thing.

Even from a few of your posts, your love to your rabbits shine through. Don't think of yourself as irresponsible, because you aren't. Everyone makes mistakes. You just have to get through them. :)

:hug:
 
I have to agree, accidents happen. Both my boysare accidents and I would never have gotten into rabbits if my friend hadn't introduced me to those 2. I was also uneducated when I got them, I had no idea a doe could get pregnant that early and at one time I did have a 3.5 month old brother/sister pair together. Luckily she did not get pregnant but I was clueless at that time too, people told me they couldn't mate until they were 7 months old.

Really it's just important that you learn from your mistakes and don't let it happen again.
 
gentle giants wrote:
I want to say something here, at the risk of starting things up again.

"You are a breeder and have a totally different opinion of bunnies to me."

Bunsterlove1969, how exactly is your opinion of rabbits different from mine? I am a breeder, and every rabbit I have ever had, or ever will have, is a pet to me, and gets the best care I know how to provide.Having a "lot" of rabbits, and selling or rehoming part of them,doesn't mean we don't care.

"and we often find that 'young' people who keep buns, put them with another end up with pregnant buns at the end of it!"

I think you would be amazed at the number of "adult" people who also haven't a clue about how animals reproduce, or how quickly it can happen! You would think the old saying "multiply like rabbits" would give them a clue!

Anyway, I know I have said this on here before, but being a "breeder"doens't mean you are indifferent about rabbits as personalities, or don't get upset when something happens to one of them, or anything like that. I am not trying to be offensive or rude, or to start a fight, butit often seems to me that people who own rabbits just as household petsare prejudiced against people who breed. I know all the little quirksand personalities of every rabbit in my barn, and I'm very proud ofthat.
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Gentle Giants, please dont fob me off with the old 'breeders are nodifferent.......' spiel! Breeders ARE different to rescues. Breeders only add to the number of unwanted buns out there, and to be honest, it IS NOT fair of the bun either.

I'm not saying you dont know anything about your buns, thats not the argument! my opinion of breeders is not very high, because i know the high number of rabbits needing homes, and the number of unwanted litters....such as Kimmeh's!

I'm sorry, but if adults are not aware of how rabbits mate then they shouldnt be allowed to keep pets! People should do research before buying a pet, as, yet again, it is not fair to take on there sponsibility of an animal if you dont know what you are doing. How isit possible for an adult not to know how animals reproduce? is this not something you learn in school? by having children themselves??? Thats apoor excuse, and a pathetic reason for trying to excuse an unwantedlitter!
 
I was not going to respond to this but I am going to go ahead and do so.

Where I live - the nearest rabbit rescue is 200 miles away....and that is one way. When I called our local animal shelter to see about rabbits(before I started breeding and before I had Tiny), I was told "Uh....we only handle cats and dogs. If you're looking for a rabbit maybe yous hould go to the feed store or to San Antonio to a pet store."

Great...the local animal shelter told me to travel 150 miles in hopes that a pet store would have rabbits.

Most of my customers - are repeat customers. No - I don't mean customers who are looking to breed. I mean customers who fell in love with their rabbit and would like to get it a friend. Customers who not only fell in love with a rabbit...but perhaps convinced a friend to get a rabbit...and they're returning bringing their friends for a rabbit.

Where would they go if I wasnt' here? They would check at the feedstore for a rabbit...oh - have I mentioned that I've had three people who bought from the feed store and wound up having the rabbit get sick or be so unsocialized that they wanted to return it? Did I mention I taught them how to socialize the rabbit? I went out to one house this weekend and not only sexed their rabbit for them (they bought two rabbits of mine hoping to have them be friends with their rabbit- and they've already scheduled their spays/neuters at the only vet who will do them - 70 miles away one way).

I'm not saying every breeder is a responsible breeder. Our local vet in town says, "Go to this vet (70 miles away) if you need help because we don't know what to do." I had someone call me and say, "help! My rabbithas diaherrea..I hear you know about rabbits." Guess what? We saved its life.

My point?

Rescues are there because people DUMP animals. They (people in general- not rescuers) have a mindset that it is ok to dump ananimal - that it is a lifetime commitment. Sometimes they got the rabbit from a breeder - but I see more "mutt" rabbits in shelters than I see purebreds.

One thing that really ticks me - is how breeders get treated by many folks. You look at this board....have a health question? How many times do you see the breeders stepping in to help in the infirmary? Or somebody adopts a rabbit from a shelter and what do they want to know?What type of rabbit it is....who answers? Most of the time...it is a breeder.

I'm going to use Pam Nock as an example here. She is one of our most respected members and prolific posters. Have a question? Ask Pam. If she doesn't know the answershe'll find it out. How did she get so knowledgable? She studied about rabbits and genetics because she is a breeder.

I think you will find that this board is one of the most breeder-friendly (and forgiving) boards on the net. If someone's made a mistake - we want them to learn from it and go on -but why beat them up? Not everyone has the common sense we wish they would have.....even adults.

I will say this - I respect rescue organizations. I respect shelters and I respect those who aim to help the bunnies.

I have a rabbit here - spayed - named Connie. One of the ugliest lionheads I've ever seen. I drove over halfway to Houston to get her -because a shelter was going to put her down for her teeth. They need clipping every few weeks.

Needless to say - I have very little respect for that shelter. She's very happy living a full life here in this "breeder's" home.

So I'll continue being a breeder and converting people in my area to"bunny people". I'm becoming known in town as "the bunny lady" and I get calls for help from folks who heard about me. Everyone who adopts a rabbit from me is given an instruction sheet and is told "I'd rather have you call me at midnight or 2 am and bring your bunny over for me to help - then to have you call me at 7 am crying that your rabbit died."

I've had people bring me their bunnies to get their nails trimmed, their fur trimmed if it went too far into their eyes (teddy style lionheads), to be sexed and much much more. I never charge for it - and I always try to educate the people.

So I guess I'll close this by saying I am a breeder - and by golly -I'm PROUD of it. I love on every single rabbit I have and I know eachof them not only by name - but their habits, their favorite toys, their favorite treats and much much more.

Peg


bunsterlove1969 wrote:
Gentle Giants,please dont fob me off with the old 'breeders are no different.......'spiel! Breeders ARE different to rescues. Breeders only add to thenumber of unwanted buns out there, and to be honest, it IS NOT fair ofthe bun either.
Click to expand...
 
TinysMom wrote:
I was not going to respond to this but I am going to go ahead and do so.

Where I live - the nearest rabbit rescue is 200 miles away....and that is one way. When I called our local animal shelter to see about rabbits(before I started breeding and before I had Tiny), I was told "Uh....we only handle cats and dogs. If you're looking for a rabbit maybe youshould go to the feed store or to San Antonio to a pet store."

Great...the local animal shelter told me to travel 150 miles in hopes that a pet store would have rabbits.

Most of my customers - are repeat customers. No - I don't mean customers who are looking to breed. I mean customers who fell in lovewith their rabbit and would like to get it a friend. Customers who notonly fell in love with a rabbit...but perhaps convinced a friend to geta rabbit...and they're returning bringing their friends for a rabbit.

Where would they go if I wasnt' here? They would check at the feedstore for a rabbit...oh - have I mentioned that I've had three peoplewho bought from the feed store and wound up having the rabbit get sickor be so unsocialized that they wanted to return it? Did I mention Itaught them how to socialize the rabbit? I went out to one house thisweekend and not only sexed their rabbit for them (they bought tworabbits of mine hoping to have them be friends with their rabbit- andthey've already scheduled their spays/neuters at the only vet who willdo them - 70 miles away one way).

I'm not saying every breeder is a responsible breeder. Our local vet intown says, "Go to this vet (70 miles away) if you need help because wedon't know what to do." I had someone call me and say, "help! My rabbithas diaherrea..I hear you know about rabbits." Guess what? We saved itslife.

My point?

Rescues are there because people DUMP animals. They (people in general- not rescuers) have a mindset that it is ok to dump ananimal - that it is a lifetime commitment. Sometimes they got therabbit from a breeder - but I see more "mutt" rabbits in shelters thanI see purebreds.

One thing that really ticks me - is how breeders get treated by manyfolks. You look at this board....have a health question? How many timesdo you see the breeders stepping in to help in the infirmary? Orsomebody adopts a rabbit from a shelter and what do they want to know?What type of rabbit it is....who answers? Most of the time...it is abreeder.

I'm going to use Pam Nock as an example here. She is one of our mostrespected members and prolific posters. Have a question? Ask Pam. Ifshe doesn't know the answer she'll find it out. How did sheget so knowledgable? She studied about rabbits and genetics because sheis a breeder.

I think you will find that this board is one of the mostbreeder-friendly (and forgiving) boards on the net. Ifsomeone's made a mistake - we want them to learn from it and go on -but why beat them up? Not everyone has the common sense we wish theywould have.....even adults.

I will say this - I respect rescue organizations. I respect shelters and I respect those who aim to help the bunnies.

I have a rabbit here - spayed - named Connie. One of the ugliestlionheads I've ever seen. I drove over halfway to Houston to get her -because a shelter was going to put her down for her teeth. They needclipping every few weeks.

Needless to say - I have very little respect for that shelter. She'svery happy living a full life here in this "breeder's" home.

So I'll continue being a breeder and converting people in my area to"bunny people". I'm becoming known in town as "the bunny lady" and Iget calls for help from folks who heard about me. Everyone who adopts arabbit from me is given an instruction sheet and is told "I'd ratherhave you call me at midnight or 2 am and bring your bunny over for meto help - then to have you call me at 7 am crying that your rabbitdied."

I've had people bring me their bunnies to get their nails trimmed,their fur trimmed if it went too far into their eyes (teddy stylelionheads), to be sexed and much much more. I never charge for it - andI always try to educate the people.

So I guess I'll close this by saying I am a breeder - and by golly -I'm PROUD of it. I love on every single rabbit I have and I know eachof them not only by name - but their habits, their favorite toys, theirfavorite treats and much much more.

Peg
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Well, Peg, we could go on for agesand argue our sides. And i will say that you are a special individua land i KNOW you are different to most breeders. I appreciate the work you do and help you give to people, but i'm afraid its not always the same happy story with the majority of breeders.
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Like i have said before, in the UK our rescue centres DO NOT put down healthy bunnies, even if they are full to the brim - i cant understand why in America its different. And its not just 'dumped' bunnies in rescue centres, its people who've had accidental litters and found they cant cope, people who dont have a clue about what it takes to look after abunny, people who get rid of bunnies because their bunny is either ugly(was shocked you even said this about Connie.....how can ANY bunny be ugly??? or is this a breeder term if your stock is 'not up to scratch?'), not friendly, not cuddly...the list goes on. These are ignorant people who havent bothered to do their homework first.
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So i guess its best to leave this argument and agree to disagree on this subject.
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i just wanted to say one thing sorry...bunsterbunny poeple can do alot of research all the want and research about every little thing and they could no everything about rabbits..but then again in my case the rabbit could escape..that could happen to anyone at anytime its not the persons fault at all..iv just beein putting my self on a guilt trip coz most people make it out like its the owners fault that the rabbit escaped..even thoough you cheked to make sure the whole thing was locked...

i do regret blaming this all on my self..thanks to the people here who have helped me and arshured me all i was thinking about its my rabbits...and bunsterbunny maybe i am actually irresponsible but that doesnt stop me from taking care of all my buns and if possible ivos babeys im still going to be there for them no matter what..

sorry pipp i just wanted to say this one thing...no more after this i just wanted people to actually know that i love my buns so much even though there just these cute little creatures they know how lovelike a human :)

kim
 
thnaks spring for asking yeah shes doing okay...she seems to be sleeping alot tho..but the really wierd thing is tho..is last night i let hunny and ivo out(i was in the room at the time)and ivo was doing loads of binkies but when shes in the cage she just lays ALOT she was lieing down a few times out the cage really wierd lol..thank you for asking tho appreciate it

kim
 
iv just felt ivos belly and theres deffinaltly some change there her belly feels more bigger and i felt movement still doesnt explain the binkies...will update if theres more info

kim x
 
Well, being pregnant takes a lot of energy! She's probably resting up lots to help her babies grow.And just does a little bit of binkies when she's out of the cage just to stretch her legs.

She must be getting close to her due date, so she's probably feeling pretty heavy, not to mention all those squirmy little guys in there.

I was just wondering if you've got something to use for a nest box yet? And have you seen her gathering hay to build a nest with yet?

--Dawn
 
I've had pregnant does do binkies. Not a lot - but sometimes.

You have to understand something....she's in her cage. If she's pregnant - she's probably sleeping a lot. Then she gets the chance to come out and get some exercise...

....if it were me - I'd do a binky or two also! A binky is a way of expressing "Wow...life is grand" and being let out of your cage to get some exercise IS a grand thing.

My pregnant does love to play in their cage - they'll throw their food bowl around and they'll play with their toys. Its just that they don't do that AS MUCH.....because they are sleeping a lot.

Peg
 
yeah im glad shes up and good she sometimes goes mad in the cage but mostly sleep or relaxes lol...

i have a shoe box that she and the babies could fit in i give her loads of hay and sometimes a bit of straw shes moves it around alot but the neats it lol thats all i see her doing just now

also i cant see her being near the birth as the accident happend on the 7th of this month
can you feel the babies when shes 2 weeks gone??

just i do feel things move and while she lays i see things move ever so slighty when i feel her belly
and iv noticed it has gotten bigger


thnx for all the help tho :kiss:kim
 
What was the exact date that the accident happened on?

Normally it's into the third and fourth week that you feel movement. At two weeks the babies will be about the size of a grape, and not moving yet.

Here's a neat gestation chart. If you remember the date, you can estimate the due date: http://islandgems.net/gestationtable.html

Can you see different spots moving? When you feel, does it feel like there are more than one areas of movement?

--Dawn
 
hmmm i feel it on one spot then i feel somewere else and i cant feel it there..i feel everyday and its on different spots...the due dat i have it probably on the 5th or 6th of next month..
 
Hmm... well, we'll just have to wait and see!

If she's not showing any interest in the nest box now (ie using it fora litter box), then you can take it out for a little bit.Wildfire would start building nests in her litter boxes about a week before giving birth, then when I saw that I would give her a nestbox. She would then build a beautiful nest for her babies.

You bunny may not even build a nest, as she is a first time mom, she may just not know what to do. In that case you'll have to watch her very carefully, and you may have to build a nest for her once the babies are born.

And don't worry about touching babies, mom will not reject them!I handled my babies from day one every day.

--Dawn
 
Well, I'm wondering if it could be a false pregnancy since the accident was on the dates you mentioned...?

Just a thought.

Peg
 
Well, I'm just wondering what the movement she's feeling is.

The bunny could just be gassy, or it could be babies. I've never seen movement earlier than three weeks, but I've only had one pregnant girl.

I guess the only sure way is to wait and see.

--Dawn
 
yup but im always prepared lol...
i do however have some good news...hunny and ivo are going to have there own room:shock::shock:

iv decided since no1s using the spare room ill put hunny and ivo in it get them NIC wirecubes build a cage and put tunnels ect in the rest ofthe room.
wellllllllll bunnies having there own room lucky beggerslol

kim
 
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