New bunny questions - diet & living with cats

[Nnenna]

Our bunny Fudge (french lop) has been living with us for 2 weeks now (he's 10 weeks old) and things are generally going well, though I have a few questions..

1. How much hay should he be eating? I give him unlimited alfalfa hay but he doesn't seem to eat much of it. He also gets unlimited pellets while he's young, which he loves and eats a lot of. Should I limit his pellets to encourage hay eating? We have both his hay and his bowl of pellets in the litterbox as it seems to really help with keeping his poo in there..

2. We also have two cats, Kip and Milkshake. They are generally curious and not easily scared (they're both under 2 years old), but they seem to be really scared of Fudge. Which is sad, because the poor guy tries to play and groom them, but they just scurry away when he gets to close (they do go near him to "check things out"). Any tips on getting them closer to Fudge?

3. Also regarding the cats.. Fudge likes to eat their food.. Which of course can't be good. I read elsewhere a pellet or 2 won't hurt, but after 3 pellets he still goes for more so I usually take away the bowl. It is kind of inconvenient because then the cats don't have food while Fudge is out and about. What should I do?

4. Our cat Kip decided to poop in Fudge's litterbox the other day... Fair enough, I was in the middle of cleaning the cat's box, but still, has anyone else had this problem? Also, I'm thinking of switching the cats' litter to compressed wood pellets like Fudge has, but I'm scared this might confuse everyone even more? How do I keep them separate?

Any advice is welcome, thank you

 

[Azerane]

While not the best solution, I might try putting your cat's food on a raised surface, such as a bench top (even though I know it's not good to encourage them up there.) But even a small table that you use as a cat food table might be the thing needed to keep Fudge out of the cat food.

As for the cat pooping in the bunny litter tray, I really don't have much to suggest I'm afraid if they all have access to the same areas it's kind of hard to prevent, except to scold the cat when you catch them in the act and redirect them to their tray. At least your cat was still using a tray, lol.

You say he eats a lot of pellets, how much is a lot? You could probably limit it to 1 cup per day if he's eating a lot more than that. It might encourage more hay eating.

 

[whiskylollipop]

1. If he's getting fat or eating more than 1 cup of pellets daily like Azerane said, limit his pellets. Otherwise, unlimited pellets is fine for now. For hay, I find that throwing out the hay that's been sitting in his box and putting in a fresh handful twice a day encourages hay eating. Bunnies tend to pick out their favourite fresh bits of hay and ignore the rest, even though the leftovers still look good to us! Also, make sure to store your hay supply well, or it will get moldy and yucky. It should be well-ventilated (say, in a drum with holes) and completely dry. That goes for buying hay as well, don't get hay with moldy dots or hay that has been rained on.

2. Cats that are scared of bunnies are infinitely better than cats that want to catch, eat, or rough house with bunnies. It sounds like Fudge is lonely and wants a furry friend. If you can afford to neuter two bunnies (could cost up to $500) maybe you could adopt another baby bun to keep him company when you're not around?

3. Do you leave unlimited food out for your cats all day? Try giving them timed meals instead, they'll adjust to a schedule well and learn to eat all they need at 2-3 fixed feeding times a day. That makes sure that there's no need to leave cat food lying about when Fudge is out.

4. That's so funny your cat decided Fudge's litterbox was his too! Cats do like going to the bathroom in wood pellets for some reason. I don't think you can keep a determined cat out of Fudge's box, but if you really want to you can get Fudge one of those litter trays with a grate over the top, where the wood pellets go in the bottom under the grate. Fudge can still use it normally, but a cat wouldn't like to as he wouldn't be able to bury his eliminations.

 

[Nnenna]

Thank you both I wouldn't say he's getting fat or anything, he's still a baby and even though he's already huge, I expect him to still double in size. I don't actually measure out how much I give him, so I'll make a note of that when his bowl is empty, give him 1 cup, and see how long that lasts. He has a pretty long and deep bowl (see picture) which I fill about 3/4th up and he eats it in a little more than a day, maybe a day and a half. I'm pretty sure it's more than 1 cup though.

For hay, we get him the Oxbow brand, and I've just been storing it in the bag it comes in.. It seems like such a waste though to put new hay in that often, especially when he barely eats it. Of course I want him to eat it, but it's pricey stuff Could I throw the "old" stuff back in the bag and just mix it in, to trick him? Oh and I thought it should be stored airtight - wouldn't a drum with holes make it go old?

Azerane - unfortunately Fudge is a jumper.. We already had to cover his pen because he would simply jump over it! So a raised surface might not keep him away, unless it's really high, but I don't think the cats would like that either (one of them is pregnant too..). I might try giving them timed meals, but we've been doing it this way (unlimited dry food) because we got pretty irregular schedules ourselves.

Whisky - two bunnies would definitely go over our budget, especially now that we have a pregnant cat as well. I really didn't think the cats would be this apprehensive, but I guess it was naive of me to think they would all cuddle together haha. The weirdest part is that they are really curious too, so they'll walk up to him, try and sniff him, but as soon as Fudge turns his head or makes a move to sniff back, they make a run for it!

That's a good tip about the grate tops, we might have to give that a try. We hope Fudge can eventually be fully free-range, so it will be a lot harder to keep the cats away from his box when it's out in the open.

 

[Azerane]

For hay, we get him the Oxbow brand, and I've just been storing it in the bag it comes in.. It seems like such a waste though to put new hay in that often, especially when he barely eats it. Of course I want him to eat it, but it's pricey stuff Could I throw the "old" stuff back in the bag and just mix it in, to trick him? Oh and I thought it should be stored airtight - wouldn't a drum with holes make it go old?

Good quality fresh hay, still has retained moisture, so if you seal it in an airtight container, it can sweat and go moldy, especially if it gets too warm. Which is why containers with holes or similar are good. I use woven plastic garden bags to store my hay, they're not airtight, but they keep the bugs out when tied at the top. I also keep it raised off the ground a little.

 

[whiskylollipop]

Ohh, that picture is too adorable! Lazy little munchkin. You're right he isn't fat, but he's definitely not slender and you can afford to limit his pellets a bit. For hay, cut some holes in the Oxbow bag. Well-aerated, dry hay will keep for much longer than suffocated, sweaty hay. It is a pain that bunnies leave so much hay untouched, but I don't think mixing old stuff with the new will trick him! It'll still be the leftover stalks that he rejected in the first place. If you go to a feed store for horses, you can score some much cheaper hay. Some people even get free hay by asking if they can pick up the hay bits that's fallen on the ground from the big bales. As long as it's horse-quality hay and not moldy, hay is hay is hay, and if you can avoid paying extra for the premium Oxbow brand label, why not.

Pregnant cat!!! Post pics of the kittens when you can! Are you going to sell them? That could raise enough funds to pay for fixing Fudge and the cats. Hope I'm not sounding preachy, but fixed animals do tend to make much more agreeable pets. For Fudge at least, when he's neutered you might be able to adopt a fixed adult rabbit to keep him company in future. Even though fixing costs for rabbits are so high, adoption fees for rabbits at shelters tend to only be around $40.

A note on fully free-range Fudge, that may not be the best idea with cats around as it is very easy for a cat to accidentally hurt and kill a bunny. Kip and Milkshake may be scared of him now, but eventually they will get used to him. If he keeps pestering them for cuddles, they'll think nothing of swiping at him with their claws like they do other cats. The difference is bunnies are not built to withstand a violent lifestyle. Their skin is VERY delicate and they don't tend to recover from injuries easily without the help of astronomical vet bills.

 

[Nnenna]

Good quality fresh hay, still has retained moisture, so if you seal it in an airtight container, it can sweat and go moldy, especially if it gets too warm. Which is why containers with holes or similar are good. I use woven plastic garden bags to store my hay, they're not airtight, but they keep the bugs out when tied at the top. I also keep it raised off the ground a little.

Thanks so much, I had no idea about the hay! I'll make sure to keep it ventilated from now on.

And that's a great idea about the horse quality hay too. I'm going to try and find a store nearby, though being in the middle of the city is probably not going to help.. How long does hay stay good, generally? I'd probably try and get a decent supply.

And not preachy at all; I do know about the benefits of spaying/neutering, and it was always in the planning for all of them! Kip (male) had always been the friendliest cat ever, and he didn't spray or anything, so there just wasn't any hurry with him. Milkshake (female) we just put off for too long.. Stupid, I know, but too late now. Kip has since been neutered, and Milkshake will get her surgery after she's had her kittens. Fudge we'll probably do in a month or two, depending on how bad his hormones get when he becomes a teenager. I'll make sure to post some kittens pics though, she's due in 2 weeks! And yes, we'll sell them, but only to people we trust to take good care of them, and the fee will be rather to cover the costs of the kittens. Unfortunately it's not only the money that's a problem when it comes to our pet count though, it's also really hard here to find an apartment that allows pets, and the more you have, the harder it gets.

I'll keep that in mind about the free-range, you're probably right.. Even though they're really friendly in general, they're still young, and I can see how some rough play could end badly (you should see them go at each other sometimes..) Maybe we'll give Fudge a separate room for when we're not there. It will still be a while regardless though, as I don't trust him near my furniture unsupervised haha!

 

[whiskylollipop]

I feel ya.

Stored well, hay will last upward of 6 months, so buying in bulk is a good idea. I specified horse-quality hay because that's the nicest hay with the most nutrients, and the only hay our bunny overlords will accept. Learned the hard way when during an unexpected hay shortage in our household my boyfriend went out and brought back a laaaarge sack of cattle-quality hay, which is much drier, older, and was completely ignored by the buns. Couldn't blame them. Had to throw it all out and make another trip to find horse-quality stuff.

Good luck with the kittens, I can't wait to see photos!

 

[Nnenna]

Oh wow, that's definitely worth a longer trip then! And yeah, I read they can be quite picky, haha! That's also why I want to start mixing hays, so he doesn't get picky about only wanting alfalfa.. Thanks a lot!

Btw, I gave him 1 cup of pellets at 9pm last night. It's now 5pm the next day and he ate almost all of it already. So I guess 1 cup will be good for now.

 

[sungura]

My rabbits get a half cup, but they eat a boat load of hay. I have had one if my cats ALMOST pee in the bunny box and I say almost because I pulled him out. Risky I know, but he was just getting settled in. Even if your rabbit is free range, you could still give him a little cage to do his business in private.

I also use horse quality hay. 5 bucks for about 30# of hay from the farm. There are farms all around me tho, so you can try a place like craigslist to see what's local in your area. You can't beat it! I was lucky enough to find a 3rd cutting mixture. 2nd or 3rd cut is THE best hay. I definitely would try to get him off pure alfalfa as it'll be more difficult when he's older.

I definitely would switch your cats to meals. All 3 of mine are on meals and it helps do much with monitoring appetite. I've caught my cats being sick a couple times before it became a problem and treating then was a piece of cake.

 

[JekkaLynn]

Is pure alfalfa not healthy for bunnies that they should stop giving the alfalfa to him?

 

[Azerane]

Is pure alfalfa not healthy for bunnies that they should stop giving the alfalfa to him?

Alfalfa is good for growing rabbits up to about 6 months of age, but after that the high calcium content can cause issues such as bladder sludge and liver or kidney (can't remember which one) problems. Hence why it's recommended to switch to another type of hay from that age.