Adopting Underage Bunnies Advice

[emilylhr]

Hi! Please let me know if this is inappropriate to be here, I'm a total newbie and I'm hoping for some advice. I recently adopted two baby bunnies (dwarf lop x mini lop), from a pet store (I know adopting is ideal, but I've been checking my local shelters for over six weeks and there's never any rabbits whatsoever close by, and there was no bunnies in pet stores either around this time, likely because of many stores refusing to sell bunnies around Easter). The pet store was told they were eight weeks old, but they're seriously tiny and seemed quite delayed in that they were all (there were four littermates) dependent on one another, their grooming seemed delayed, etc. The pet store kept them in for two weeks to make sure they were developing safely, and I took them home yesterday. Sorry for a delayed explanation and in advance for a lot of questions, but basically, I'm honestly quite inexperienced with baby bunnies, so if anyone could be of help with some questions and also general advice, I'd be eternally grateful.
One of my primary concerns is that the pet store was feeding them carrots, apples, and I'd assume other veggies to help them gain weight. I know this is dangerous, but I'd like to know if taking them off that without easing them off it could pose any risk to them. I'm currently feeding them a diet of primarily alfalfa hay and a little bit of oaten hay, as I believe the store might've been feeding them that before (it's from the same store) and a little bit of pellets to help them continue gaining weight.
Also, is there any serious risks to taking them off their mum at ~6 weeks old, possibly younger. I'm very concerned for them on that front. I have no idea if they are eight weeks old and just tiny from their breed, or if they're a lot younger. I have a 12wo dwarf lop and she's so much bigger, and I've also had two baby bunnies previously (including a 10wo Netherland dwarf) and they've all been substantially larger than these guys.
Sorry for so many questions, but also- is it safe to bond these guys with my other young rabbit, considering they are so tiny? Could she potentially pose a risk to their immune or digestive systems? I'm not planning on leaving them together unsupervised for at least a month, if not more, but I have introduced them in a controlled environment.
And finally, is there any other advice anyone could suggest about how to look after them? I know I'm likely making so many mistakes and I just really want to do the best I can by these guys. Also, would anyone have any idea how old they appear to be, roughly (I'll attach photos of them and next to both my 12wo dwarf lop and my hand)? I likely asked a lot of stupid questions and rambled a lot, but I'm trying to run through everything that could go wrong to plan accordingly, and I figure it'd be better to ask and prevent something over not doing so to maintain my pride and have such an issue occur that I could've prevented. Thank you, sincerely, to anyone who helps. I appreciate this resource being available.

 

[emilylhr]

Also, just because I can see someone seeing the attached pictures and being concerned that they're in such a tiny cage. This is definitely not their living quarters. I'm just using it as a small home base so I can take them into my room at night to monitor them overnight, and for separation purposes in bonding until I can put my 12wo bunny and these two in a new, bigger condo. They have access to an (indoor) exercise area all day and can run around to their hearts' content.

 

[Hermelin]

One of my primary concerns is that the pet store was feeding them carrots, apples, and I'd assume other veggies to help them gain weight. I know this is dangerous, but I'd like to know if taking them off that without easing them off it could pose any risk to them. I'm currently feeding them a diet of primarily alfalfa hay and a little bit of oaten hay, as I believe the store might've been feeding them that before (it's from the same store) and a little bit of pellets to help them continue gaining weight.

Take everything away, it won’t cause any problem. There’s a bigger chance problem will start if they are being feed on this diet for a longer time.

You can introduce your kits with your other kit but keep in mind their bond might break, when they all get hormonal. You must also make sure all rabbits are females, otherwise if one of them are a buck it can breed with your does and will need to be kept away from the doe until it’s neutered.

The cage it’s quite small but you can start with it, easily to litter train them.

Are you feeding pellets or a mix food, if it’s mixed slowly change it to a pure pellet. Don’t really see any hay or are you using the bedding as hay.

Rabbits are supposed to eat 90% hay and 10 % veggies when they are adults and a little pellets. But veggies are something you will have to wait until they get older.

6 weeks some rabbits are already weaned from their mothers but some are not ready to move away. But you have nothing to worry about.

 

[Augustus&HazelGrace]

You bought 2 babies. This is probably your main mistake, especially beings you want to bond them. Between 4-6 months old they will hit the "teenager stage" and that's when hormones will kick in. So whatever " bonding " progress you think you have made will go out the window. At 12 weeks old you need to separate them so that no fights occur and wait until they are old enough to be spayed and/ neutered. Plus you never stated whether these were male or female. Baby bonds never count.
Also, don't try to bond with your older bun he/she needs to be spayed/neutered too before you try the trio bonding.
They could be 8 weeks, I have 4-week olds and they are wayyyyy smaller than my other litter the same age.
And them not getting moms milk at 6 weeks old is not detrimental most of my moms wean at 5 weeks and I have nothing to do with it. I typically remove from mom at 6 weeks and sell at 7 weeks.

 

[emilylhr]

Take everything away, it won’t cause any problem. There’s a bigger chance problem will start if they are being feed on this diet for a longer time.

You can introduce your kits with your other kit but keep in mind their bond might break, when they all get hormonal. You must also make sure all rabbits are females, otherwise if one of them are a buck it can breed with your does and will need to be kept away from the doe until it’s neutered.

The cage it’s quite small but you can start with it, easily to litter train them.

Are you feeding pellets or a mix food, if it’s mixed slowly change it to a pure pellet. Don’t really see any hay or are you using the bedding as hay.

Rabbits are supposed to eat 90% hay and 10 % veggies when they are adults and a little pellets. But veggies are something you will have to wait until they get older.

6 weeks some rabbits are already weaned from their mothers but some are not ready to move away. But you have nothing to worry about.

Thanks for your response! I believe the two I bought are both boys, and my other bunny is a girl. She'll be spayed as soon as she can, pretty much, she's just a bit too young for my vets to right now (they start at 4 months). But they will all be spayed and neutered before I try any bonding.
Cage is inside a fair sized pen, so I can cover them up at night and make sure they're safe overnight. I won't be using it for very long, just as a temporary transition. As they grow, they won't be kept in this set up anymore and will get a big condo.
I'm feeding them pure pellets from a trusted feed store, and definitely not planning on introducing veggies until they're old enough. Hay is in their pen which is not in the photos, and it's being used as bedding for their cage.
Thank you so much for your advice and expertise! I appreciate it so much and I'm sure these guys will too

 

[emilylhr]

You bought 2 babies. This is probably your main mistake, especially beings you want to bond them. Between 4-6 months old they will hit the "teenager stage" and that's when hormones will kick in. So whatever " bonding " progress you think you have made will go out the window. At 12 weeks old you need to separate them so that no fights occur and wait until they are old enough to be spayed and/ neutered. Plus you never stated whether these were male or female. Baby bonds never count.
Also, don't try to bond with your older bun he/she needs to be spayed/neutered too before you try the trio bonding.
They could be 8 weeks, I have 4-week olds and they are wayyyyy smaller than my other litter the same age.
And them not getting moms milk at 6 weeks old is not detrimental most of my moms wean at 5 weeks and I have nothing to do with it. I typically remove from mom at 6 weeks and sell at 7 weeks.

I'm aware of how puberty throws a spanner in the works, haha. My older bun is a girl and the little ones are apparently both boys, but I can't tell for sure until they get a bit older. They will all be spayed and neutered before I try to bond them. Thanks for your knowledge about weaning them and the size! I'm glad that they should be okay.

 

[Imbrium]

First of all, welcome to RO! You're in the right spot and I'm glad you've found us. Also, kudos to you for exhausting the adoption options in your area before buying from a pet store .

One of my primary concerns is that the pet store was feeding them carrots, apples, and I'd assume other veggies to help them gain weight. I know this is dangerous, but I'd like to know if taking them off that without easing them off it could pose any risk to them. I'm currently feeding them a diet of primarily alfalfa hay and a little bit of oaten hay, as I believe the store might've been feeding them that before (it's from the same store) and a little bit of pellets to help them continue gaining weight.

I would scrap the carrots, apples and other veggies - you can still feed *small* amounts of veggies and fruits they're already used to (though I recommend waiting until 12+ weeks before introducing any fresh food you aren't certain they've already had). See HRS's site for diet info. On the one hand, it's good to help them gain some weight... on the other hand, after going through months of frustration trying to get 7 month old rabbits to give up the alfalfa and eat grass hay, I would recommend a mix of no more than 50% alfalfa with the rest grass hay (alfalfa is crack). Increase the amount of grass hay (or change grass hays) gradually over the course of like 3 days.

Be aware that the oats in oat hay are very high carb/high calorie and you should remove the oats before feeding the hay (some oats is ok, given their low weight, but remove most of them). In general, non-cereal grass hays like timothy, orchard, "meadow" (which I believe is just another name for orchard), bluegrass, etc. are usually better (or at least less tedious to feed). You can get horse-quality grass hay by the bale from feed stores at a fraction of the price pet stores charge.

Babies can have unlimited pellets (though most people find their rabbits do best if restricted to an amount no more than 2x what their adult ration (based on expected adult weight) will be). Again, increase quantity gradually over a few days.

Also, is there any serious risks to taking them off their mum at ~6 weeks old, possibly younger. I'm very concerned for them on that front. I have no idea if they are eight weeks old and just tiny from their breed, or if they're a lot younger.

Depending on the size of the litter, it isn't uncommon for some of the rabbits in a litter to be weaned as young as 5-6 weeks. Younger than 5 weeks, there can definitely be issues... but if they survived without mom for two weeks in the pet store then they've dodged most potential bullets. Don't stress yourself out about it too much, just work on getting them transitioned from the crummy pet store diet to an appropriate one.

Sorry for so many questions, but also- is it safe to bond these guys with my other young rabbit, considering they are so tiny? Could she potentially pose a risk to their immune or digestive systems? I'm not planning on leaving them together unsupervised for at least a month, if not more, but I have introduced them in a controlled environment.

Based on my own experience of bringing home a 7 week old lionhead and 8 week old (false dwarf) Holland Lop (aka dwarf lop outside the US), I would guess that your new ones are around 9 weeks old (maybe 10). Rabbits tend to have a pretty big growth spurt between 10 and 12 weeks. They look perky and healthy as far as what I see in the pictures.

In addition to needing everyone spayed/neutered for bonding (well, the babies can stay together for now if you're sure they're the same gender, but should be separated around 16 weeks or at the first sign of fighting if they're not big enough for spay/neuter surgery yet), you should be aware that it takes 4 weeks for females' hormones to fade and 6-8 weeks for males. By the time your 12 week old is old enough to get snipped and has waited the appropriate amount of time for hormones to fade, your little ones will be too old to try to forge a "baby bond" between them and the older bunny. It's best to wait on bonding until the little ones' hormones are also gone.

[Note: if the babies are the same gender and make it until their spay/neuter date without fighting or being separated, they can be put back together immediately... but be sure to look out for signs of fighting afterward. My girls never had to be permanently separated but did have a couple minor altercations after their surgeries, spend a few days apart and then had to have their bond reset in the neutral territory that was my neighbor's kitchen.]

And finally, is there any other advice anyone could suggest about how to look after them? I know I'm likely making so many mistakes and I just really want to do the best I can by these guys. I likely asked a lot of stupid questions and rambled a lot, but I'm trying to run through everything that could go wrong to plan accordingly, and I figure it'd be better to ask and prevent something over not doing so to maintain my pride and have such an issue occur that I could've prevented. Thank you, sincerely, to anyone who helps. I appreciate this resource being available.

First of all, the only stupid question is the one you're afraid to ask. Cliche, but true.

Secondly, the #1 piece of advice I have to offer based on your post is to trust your instincts. Continue to ask if you're unsure about things, of course, but you're clearly a concerned, caring bunny parent who does their research and isn't afraid to ask for help. Be confident in yourself! If not for you, then for your bunns. I was a pretty paranoid bunny momma too, when I first brought home two tiny fluffs... but don't go into it thinking you're going to screw everything up because you know what? Everyone makes some mistakes and no one makes all of the mistakes. In the end, I'm sure you and your bunnies will get through their babyhood and teenage years just fine .

Edit: Oh, and store-bought cage inside a small pen is perfectly fine at their age - I started out that way too. I wouldn't move them to a NIC condo (if that's the condo you meant) until a minimum of 12 weeks old anyway. I tried it when my lionhead was 11 weeks and my Holland (dwarf) lop was 12 weeks and that silly Nala got her head stuck in the grids! I was SURE I had measured and concluded that her head wouldn't fit, but somehow it did and when her ears popped back up on the far side, she got stuck.

Having never paid attention to the WHY of kids getting their head stuck in the banister in 80s sitcoms, I didn't even think about the ears! I panicked, tried lubing her up with a little vegetable oil (very regrettable) then cut the grid in question loose and was banging on my neighbor's door at 7:30 in the morning (lionhead and grid in hand) asking if they had anything that could snip wire. The wifey was looking through her husband's tools, then commented that it sort of looked like the only thing trapping Nala's head was the ears. I fed them back through and her head popped right out! Whew!!

Like I said, everyone makes some mistakes, lol.

 

[emilylhr]

First of all, welcome to RO! You're in the right spot and I'm glad you've found us. Also, kudos to you for exhausting the adoption options in your area before buying from a pet store .


I would scrap the carrots, apples and other veggies - you can still feed *small* amounts of veggies and fruits they're already used to (though I recommend waiting until 12+ weeks before introducing any fresh food you aren't certain they've already had). See HRS's site for diet info. On the one hand, it's good to help them gain some weight... on the other hand, after going through months of frustration trying to get 7 month old rabbits to give up the alfalfa and eat grass hay, I would recommend a mix of no more than 50% alfalfa with the rest grass hay (alfalfa is crack). Increase the amount of grass hay (or change grass hays) gradually over the course of like 3 days.

Be aware that the oats in oat hay are very high carb/high calorie and you should remove the oats before feeding the hay (some oats is ok, given their low weight, but remove most of them). In general, non-cereal grass hays like timothy, orchard, "meadow" (which I believe is just another name for orchard), bluegrass, etc. are usually better (or at least less tedious to feed). You can get horse-quality grass hay by the bale from feed stores at a fraction of the price pet stores charge.

Babies can have unlimited pellets (though most people find their rabbits do best if restricted to an amount no more than 2x what their adult ration (based on expected adult weight) will be). Again, increase quantity gradually over a few days.


Depending on the size of the litter, it isn't uncommon for some of the rabbits in a litter to be weaned as young as 5-6 weeks. Younger than 5 weeks, there can definitely be issues... but if they survived without mom for two weeks in the pet store then they've dodged most potential bullets. Don't stress yourself out about it too much, just work on getting them transitioned from the crummy pet store diet to an appropriate one.


Based on my own experience of bringing home a 7 week old lionhead and 8 week old (false dwarf) Holland Lop (aka dwarf lop outside the US), I would guess that your new ones are around 9 weeks old (maybe 10). Rabbits tend to have a pretty big growth spurt between 10 and 12 weeks. They look perky and healthy as far as what I see in the pictures.

In addition to needing everyone spayed/neutered for bonding (well, the babies can stay together for now if you're sure they're the same gender, but should be separated around 16 weeks or at the first sign of fighting if they're not big enough for spay/neuter surgery yet), you should be aware that it takes 4 weeks for females' hormones to fade and 6-8 weeks for males. By the time your 12 week old is old enough to get snipped and has waited the appropriate amount of time for hormones to fade, your little ones will be too old to try to forge a "baby bond" between them and the older bunny. It's best to wait on bonding until the little ones' hormones are also gone.

[Note: if the babies are the same gender and make it until their spay/neuter date without fighting or being separated, they can be put back together immediately... but be sure to look out for signs of fighting afterward. My girls never had to be permanently separated but did have a couple minor altercations after their surgeries, spend a few days apart and then had to have their bond reset in the neutral territory that was my neighbor's kitchen.]



First of all, the only stupid question is the one you're afraid to ask. Cliche, but true.

Secondly, the #1 piece of advice I have to offer based on your post is to trust your instincts. Continue to ask if you're unsure about things, of course, but you're clearly a concerned, caring bunny parent who does their research and isn't afraid to ask for help. Be confident in yourself! If not for you, then for your bunns. I was a pretty paranoid bunny momma too, when I first brought home two tiny fluffs... but don't go into it thinking you're going to screw everything up because you know what? Everyone makes some mistakes and no one makes all of the mistakes. In the end, I'm sure you and your bunnies will get through their babyhood and teenage years just fine .

Edit: Oh, and store-bought cage inside a small pen is perfectly fine at their age - I started out that way too. I wouldn't move them to a NIC condo (if that's the condo you meant) until a minimum of 12 weeks old anyway. I tried it when my lionhead was 11 weeks and my Holland (dwarf) lop was 12 weeks and that silly Nala got her head stuck in the grids! I was SURE I had measured and concluded that her head wouldn't fit, but somehow it did and when her ears popped back up on the far side, she got stuck.

Having never paid attention to the WHY of kids getting their head stuck in the banister in 80s sitcoms, I didn't even think about the ears! I panicked, tried lubing her up with a little vegetable oil (very regrettable) then cut the grid in question loose and was banging on my neighbor's door at 7:30 in the morning (lionhead and grid in hand) asking if they had anything that could snip wire. The wifey was looking through her husband's tools, then commented that it sort of looked like the only thing trapping Nala's head was the ears. I fed them back through and her head popped right out! Whew!!

Like I said, everyone makes some mistakes, lol.

Wow! Thank you so much for your welcome and all of your answers! I really appreciate your tips about the hay. I'll definitely be separating the oaten until I can transition them off it and onto grass hays. The place I buy my alfalfa from offers timothy too, so transitioning them onto a mixture of timothy and alfalfa is definitely achievable.
Thank you for your reassurance about being weaned at 6 weeks. They seem quite happy and energetic, which I'm hoping means the diet is working for them currently, even though improvements still need to be made.
It's a relief to hear they're 9wo and I'm looking forward to them hitting that growth spurt.
I'll be keeping a keen eye on them for signs of aggression in puberty, especially since they're both males. The last thing I'd want is to bond them with my other bun and have a litter considering there are so many buns without homes already, even if not so much in my area. I don't have the resources to truly find potential babies the best forever homes, nor keep them myself, so they won't be around each other until they've recovered from their surgeries. I appreciate your info on this.
Thank you so much for your advice! I'm really working on being more confident around animals and trusting myself more. I typically seem tense, which animals that don't have much experience with me pick up on and I stress them out. It's not good for them, so I hope I can get over this learning curve of really young buns and be more confident for their security, especially for prey animals like bunnies.
Their condo will be made from something similar to NIC grids, just a sheets a lot larger. For some reason, I can't find NIC grids anywhere in Australia. Thanks for that tip! My previous bunny did something similar- during the latter stages of the bonding process with my other rabbit, I'd separated the two between a new cage, a dog crate, and a pen in between the two, so there weren't any familiar settings. She was in the pen and squeezed into the dog crate the bun I was trying to bond her with was in. Luckily, she was a young Netherland dwarf and made it through safely. I was shocked to find out how much of her was fur and how she could squeeze through something so tiny. But from then, the bonding process seemed to start working and they ended up being bonded better than I'd ever expected. Couldn't replicate it if I tried. I'm glad to hear Nala was okay!
Again, thank you so much for your response. I'll be sure to use the information and my buns will be better for it. Thank you!

 

[Imbrium]

Technically, oat hay IS grass hay, as are the far less common "cereal" hays like wheat and rye. With cereal hays, the only concern is the calorie rich seed heads (like the oats).

I really do see so much potential in you to be an amazing bunny slave. Keep telling yourself that you can trust your instincts and that you and your bunns will figure things out together. With my husband's anxiety, it really helps him to say positive statements about himself out loud. It also seems to help when I say the positive statements with him, if you have someone who can do that with you.