Philosophy for best care of your bunnies?

Hi everyone,
I launched an online pet boutique early this year, and the mission is to sell products that promote the mental and physical well-being of pets. In order to not compete with Petco, Petsmart, Amazon, etc. I am always looking for high-quality, locally-made stuff. Having said that, I haven't had much success finding the best products for small pets or birds. So what I have in my shop currently is just commodity stuff that you can find for cheaper at the larger retailers.
I've been lurking here and in some other small pet forums and it seems to me that people just don't want to spend much money on things for the little ones. Or put another way, rather than buying a nice, large hutch, people are more inclined to build their own or buy a hand-me-down one. Is that a correct perception?
Another question: are there any products (toys or habitat items) that you really want for your buns but have trouble finding anywhere? If you can give me some leads, maybe I can find them and then have better offerings in my shop.

Thoughts, opinions?
Sharon at Something Special Pet Supplies

SumpinSpecial said:

I've been lurking here and in some other small pet forums and it seems to me that people just don't want to spend much money on things for the little ones. Or put another way, rather than buying a nice, large hutch, people are more inclined to build their own or buy a hand-me-down one. Is that a correct perception?
Another question: are there any products (toys or habitat items) that you really want for your buns but have trouble finding anywhere? If you can give me some leads, maybe I can find them and then have better offerings in my shop.

Thoughts, opinions?
Sharon at Something Special Pet Supplies

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While this is true, that is far from the correct way to perceive what is being done. People are more likely to BUILD their own cage because hutches and cages that can be PURCHASD are extremely inadequate in the eyes of most rabbit owners because they fail to provide what people think their rabbits need, mainly SPACE! Yes brand new hutches are nice and pretty, but they are small and overpriced. Why would I spend $200-$300 on a wood hutch that my rabbit wont be spending much time in because its so small they would need even more free time out of it for exercise, when for under $100 I can buy a few packs of Cube panels and zap straps and build a massive cage in less then a day. Heck I picked up close to 200 of those cube panels for free on Craigslist. As for building wooden hutches, again it usually works out cheaper, you can build it the exact size you need for your space and make it the way you want.

And the best rabbit and cat toys most of the time are free as well. My animals have more fun with a cardboard box then something purchased. My parrot LOVES a handful of straws zap strapped tightly together to make a spikey ball she can destroy. Toilet paper tubs with treats inside.

When you look at most pet store items in depth, their just really expensive plastic. My rabbits and parrots LOVE there thrift shop baby rattles. A $30 parrot toy will last my parrot 5 minutes before she has killed it, but a free phonebook might last a few days.

However an item I would like to see more of out there for all bunny owners, are suitable cat treat balls that they can put their rabbits pellets into and have the rabbit forage for its food. Lots of treat balls for dogs, less for cats. Missyscove has posts on here somewhere if her rabbits using one.
http://www.rabbitsonline.net/showpost.php?p=998456&postcount=112

https://www.amazon.ca/Hagen-Living-...4HYW9B8/ref=pd_sxp_f_r?tag=ca-skim1x169169-20

So its not that people don't want to spend the money, they just don't have too when other options are not only cheaper but better for their animal in the long run.

Do you ponder to have items locally manufactured to your specifications ( or do it yourself)?

I agree with Watermelons about cages. Most cages sold in petshops are too small. Whenever I see someone on a forum bragging about the great big cage they bought for their rabbits, they are often multi storeys cages that give more space in theory BUT are almost always not adapted for rabbits with tiny floors and steep 'stairs'. Those are more chinchilla or ferret cages actually, as a rabbit needs a flat space where he can run, you need enough space to put a litterbox (and most rabbits are too big for the tiny corner litterboxes you use with ferrets) and steep stairs / big openings on 2, 3 or 4 floors are dangerous for rabbits, especially when they are young or get older. I'm not even speaking about all the cages that you can only open from the top, so the rabbits can't get in and out on their own ; or about the cages which open with the "door" going down which cause accidents like rabbits paws getting trapped between the bars and broken during a jump. Some cages have a run attached, which is good as it is often what people build, but it is very expensive for something that is generally a lot smaller than what you would do yourself.
Also, the "home made" cages build with those cube thingy I don't know the name of in English have the great advantage of being very adjustable. I think if you could get a decent sized cage with a run attached that you could change the shape of to fit the room you put it in, it would appeal to more rabbits' owners. As it is, I've never seen a cage in a petshop that was perfect for rabbits... so i gave mine their own room ^^
Sisal mats are the best thing ever for (my?) rabbits. they love it, and they wear their nails while they scratch them. It's not always easy to find, so I would buy them if my petshop had some.

Preitler said:

Do you ponder to have items locally manufactured to your specifications ( or do it yourself)?

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Aki and Watermelon, thank you for your comments. I have to admit I don't have a rabbit, so need to learn about them through kind people like you guys. I've had friends who had them, so I know they're lovely creatures. I suspect that they're under-appreciated as pets.

Preitler, I'm looking for things created by craftspeople, because you can't find that stuff at Target or Petco or Amazon. I can't compete with the "big boys", so I don't even want to try. I need to get rid of the hutches in my shop and replace them with better merchandise that's more aligned with my mission. Here's an example of what we have in greyhound "circles":

There are people who love to sew, and our greyhounds have long necks that just cry out for ornamentation. So those people make and sell collars. Most are made with gorgeous ribbon fabric, some actually have rhinestones. Other greyhound people make coats designed to fit long, thin greyhound bodies or harnesses. A few people like this have established brand names in the social community, and I've managed to work with a couple of them to sell their products (under their names). So while I'm working to establish my own brand name as a boutiquey pet shop, I'm including their products in my product lines.

I've discovered that there are people like this in the bird world - who make and sell bird toys - but haven't managed yet to establish a business relationship with any of them. I'm curious if people like this are in the bunny/ferret/rat communities as well.

It can be a lot of work being a craftsperson making things, especially when you get a reputation and orders start coming in on a regular basis. I suspect that lots of those people would rather do what they love (making things) rather than managing a website, doing marketing, handling customer questions or returns, etc. I can do the website and marketing and junk if I can find craftspeople to supply the merchandise.

Another thought I have: since hutches are bulky and heavy and make for poor shipping logistics and costs, is there perhaps an opportunity to sell hutch designs? Say, a design would include a list of the parts needed (nails, wood and what sizes, etc) and then instructions for how to build it. Would that be worth buying?

I'm one of those people who improvises and builds everything on my own. If a cage or tank or whatever breaks, I save the pieces and reuse them. I save everything from cages to deli cups (great enclosures for gecko hatchlings or tarantulas). The other day my 10 gallon fish tank started leaking. It's now the new home of my 6 inch tarantula. My bunnies live in a 4 storey CC condo (soon to be three because they never use the top level) and have their own attached huge CC pen. That top level is going to become a bigger cage for my rats.

I also used to have two greyhounds, so I'm very familiar with the struggle to find clothes that fit them as well as keeping them warm and dry in Canadian winters. I made them neck warmers out of the fleece inner sleeves of a jacket. Their coats were home sewn, given to me by a lady whose dog passed away.

Every time I go to Petsmart it's an exercise in frustration. They never have what I want in stock, and when they do it's always poor quality or the wrong size/type. Today I was looking for a pigloo for my hedgehog. All they had was a size a mouse would have been cramped in. The next size up you could have stabled a pair of oxen in, and it was priced accordingly. I do a lot of my pet supply shopping at Home Depot and the dollar store.

Things you could stock or make: carry/snuggle bags for sugar gliders, hedgehogs and other small pets. Fleece tunnels and igloos that can be folded down (with snaps) and washed. Knapsack pet carriers (I'd love to bring my little dog or cats with me on my scooter!) Greyhound wear that's fashionable, reversible or two-way, rain slicker on the outside, detachable fleece on the inside. Greyhound boots that actually FIT, and STAY ON. Or, make boot suspenders for them, they work kind of like strings on mittens. Stylish belly bands for male Greyhounds. Pretty skirts and neckwear for the Greyhound ladies. Fleece liners for cages, with grommets and metal shower curtain hooks. Multi-level hammocks for small pets, with the levels removable so they can be washed while leaving the rest in the cage. Get some U-haul blankets (Home Depot), cut them to smaller sizes and stitch the edges, they make great cheap cage liners, snuggle bags and hammocks. Mix and match pieces to let the customer choose and build their own small animal and bird toys. Source what you can from recyclers or thrift shops, people like stuff that's reused or environmentally friendly.

And if you REALLY want to make some money, make stuff for Sphynx cats! Sphynx owners LOVE to dress their cats up, take them out wearing a snazzy harness, and show them off! Their big message board is sphynxlair.com

And here's a thought: sell the parts to use to make CC cages, along with plans that the customer can follow. You could sell complete kits with the plans - the cubes (and you can get them in colours, more fun than white or black) as well as the zip ties. Include pre-made fleece or Uhaul blanket liners for the cage and shelves. You could even sell the coroplast pieces cut to size, assuming you're selling locally. If not, just sell the plan with instructions, maybe with a paper template to help them cut the coroplast to size. You could even throw in a few extras like toys and hammocks if you wanted. Some people like to doll up their cages with covers, curtains etc - there could be a market to sell those to go with your CC cage kits.

Blackrabbits, you've posted a TON of great information and ideas, thank you! I'll do some research to see if I can find people who make the things you've mentioned and see if they would be willing to make things for me to sell. I operate my shop while working a full time day job, so I don't have time to make my own stuff to sell. I'll check out the sphynx cat forum you mentioned and see what things they want. I have some really cool stuff for cats but haven't yet reached out to cat shoppers as much as I should yet - I'm working on that. If I could include more high quality stuff, that would be better.

I'm sorry, what does CC stand for when you mention cages, condos or pens? It's not Critter Nation, right, that would be CN?

Is it allowed for me to post my shop link here so people can see what I have? Can I add it to my signature? Or is there a strict rule against marketing/advertising in the forum?

SumpinSpecial said:

Blackrabbits, you've posted a TON of great information and ideas, thank you! I'll do some research to see if I can find people who make the things you've mentioned and see if they would be willing to make things for me to sell. I operate my shop while working a full time day job, so I don't have time to make my own stuff to sell. I'll check out the sphynx cat forum you mentioned and see what things they want. I have some really cool stuff for cats but haven't yet reached out to cat shoppers as much as I should yet - I'm working on that. If I could include more high quality stuff, that would be better.

I'm sorry, what does CC stand for when you mention cages, condos or pens? It's not Critter Nation, right, that would be CN?

Is it allowed for me to post my shop link here so people can see what I have? Can I add it to my signature? Or is there a strict rule against marketing/advertising in the forum?

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I'm glad you found some of my ideas useful! I've always kept a wide range of pets and I've learned how to care for them on a budget. CC cages are made from enamelled metal grid squares that were originally made as part of kits to build storage cubes for small spaces like dorms or cupboards. The second C stands for cube, I forget what the first C stands for. "CC cage" is the most commonly used term for a cage made out of these squares. Of course you can come up with a name for your kits that newbies can understand. Here's a link to a kit: https://www.homedepot.ca/en/home/p.3-pack-storage-cube.1000141561.html

When sourcing these cubes, beware of cheap flimsy imitations. You can get them at the dollar store but I wouldn't recommend it. Dollar store cubes are smaller, the wire is a lot thinner and the square openings between the wires are a lot bigger. This makes them too flimsy to build a cage with, though they can be used as a base under coroplast or wood to build shelves.

Re finding people who can sew pouches, liners etc. There are people who already sell these items which they make at home. I'm guessing some might be interested in making them for a third party. Check local pet ads, Etsy, Ebay and you have a good chance of finding someone. Check message boards for sugar gliders, hedgehogs, rats, ferrets, guinea pigs and other small pets. Many small pet owners like to carry their pets in snuggle or bonding pouches. And these same owners use fabric cage and shelf liners as well as hammocks etc.

Cool, I'll take a look at the Home Depot link for the CC kit and then see if I can find a source for better quality ones.

Also, I remembered that I've been chatting with a craftsperson who makes fabric things for small dogs and was interested in selling wholesale to me. I reached out to her about doing small pet carry sacks, hammocks and burrow beds and she said she'd be glad to make them for me if I provide measurements! So I'll be doing a little research to find the best sizes of these things for the variety of small pets there are.

One other thought I had, reading your replies... when you carry a sugar glider or other little one in a knapsack/carrybag, what prevents it from jumping out and getting lost? Do you need to put some sort of tiny leash/harness on it for safety?

SumpinSpecial said:

One other thought I had, reading your replies... when you carry a sugar glider or other little one in a knapsack/carrybag, what prevents it from jumping out and getting lost? Do you need to put some sort of tiny leash/harness on it for safety?

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The snuggle pouches are usually worn like a crossbody purse on a strap. I've never owned one so I'm not sure how or if the animal is secured in the pouch. I know my hedgehog snuggles in a blanket and doesn't move if I carry him around that way. I am guessing sugar gliders (marsupials) and hedgies just snuggle down into the bag and stay there. If closures are needed it's probably done with snaps. It would be best to ask someone who makes them, or see if you can find a site online that shows how they're made.

Okay. Maybe they have a "hide in momma's pouch" kind of instinct.

I found one local craftsperson who makes things like this, and I do believe she uses snaps. Do you guys think the size of the carrier will matter? Where I'm going with that question is I wonder how many different sizes I need to offer to cater to everything from a sugar glider to a large rabbit. (Do bunny people ever carry their buns around town? I've seen one man at a pet event once who had a CAT in a cute little parka on his back, but that's pretty uncommon, lol!)

SumpinSpecial said:

Okay. Maybe they have a "hide in momma's pouch" kind of instinct.

I found one local craftsperson who makes things like this, and I do believe she uses snaps. Do you guys think the size of the carrier will matter? Where I'm going with that question is I wonder how many different sizes I need to offer to cater to everything from a sugar glider to a large rabbit. (Do bunny people ever carry their buns around town? I've seen one man at a pet event once who had a CAT in a cute little parka on his back, but that's pretty uncommon, lol!)

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Here's a sugar glider breeder's website, she makes the pouches using drawstring closures: www.torontosugarglider.com

Re "parka" on his back, it sounds like one of these carriers, which has a drawstring opening where the pet can stick their head out. This style comes as carrying bags, slings and purses, lots of people use them to show off their yorkies and chihuahuas: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B00ANIX8NA/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

Amazon has plenty of styles of pet carrier available, it's a good place to find design ideas.

SumpinSpecial said:

Okay. Maybe they have a "hide in momma's pouch" kind of instinct.

I found one local craftsperson who makes things like this, and I do believe she uses snaps. Do you guys think the size of the carrier will matter? Where I'm going with that question is I wonder how many different sizes I need to offer to cater to everything from a sugar glider to a large rabbit. (Do bunny people ever carry their buns around town? I've seen one man at a pet event once who had a CAT in a cute little parka on his back, but that's pretty uncommon, lol!)

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Just don't offer sizes for animals like Guinea Pigs or rabbits. It is very unsuitable for rabbits to be in a pouch and carried around. And if anyone asks for one that size, educate them on how inappropriate it is for their animal. They need a flat surface and are better to be allowed to hop on their own in a harness or in a pet stroller. This gives them the choice of staying on their 4 feet or flopping down. Backpacks and sacks for rabbits are a big no no. Their bodys are not designed that way.
Rats and ferrets and Sugar gliders, absolutely! SO perhaps just sugar glider size to ferret size? And a way to guarantee its secure. Maybe a little mesh (strong mesh) window for air flow that can be closed from the outside like a tent window. That way you can have more secure ties at the opening to avoid escapees? Especially those ferrets

Thanks for the links and info. The cat in the parka that I saw was literally... a parka, like this:

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B01KUUUR16/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

The man was wearing a matching (human-sized) one so I couldn't tell how the cat was affixed to his back. The cat looked super chill, like they did that every day. Even when the man knelt down to pet our greyhounds, putting the kitty within nom range if any of our hounds were cat-eaters (in other words, he wasn't very smart). Fortunately for him, we don't take high prey dogs to places where small dogs and other critters abound, so our pups didn't even notice his kitty. But it was one of the cutest and wildest things I've seen at a pet event!

A note to follow up on the "CC" cages. They are usually "C&C" cages being referred to and those are specifically for guinea pigs. The two Cs are "cubes" and "coroplast." That is how piggie cages are often made.

Rabbit owners make a distinction and may refer to these cages as NIC cages (from the brand of cubes called Neat Idea Cubes) or simply as "cube cages." Rabbit cages typically do NOT use the coroplast because it is quite slippery for a rabbit. It also is unnecessary to have the bottom water proof since rabbits litter train. Coroplast is convenient for piggies because only some litter train. (coroplast is corrugated plastic)

There are already free tutorials online on how to make these cube cages for rabbits. I do not know of any places that sell complete kits for such rabbit cages.

If you hop onto guineapigcages.com you will see their shop that sells kits for C&C cages and also has lots of accessories. These are all great for piggies and gives you an idea of blackrabbits suggestions. Much of what is on that site, however, would not be appropriate for rabbits. The concept, however, is the same.

Cube cages are inappropriate for outdoors. So when you mentioned plans for wood hutches, that would cater to outdoor housing. That whole topic of indoor vs outdoor can be controversial in itself.

Rabbits should never be carried around. Pet strollers are the way to go for that.

Watermelons said:

Backpacks and sacks for rabbits are a big no no. Their bodys are not designed that way.
Rats and ferrets and Sugar gliders, absolutely! SO perhaps just sugar glider size to ferret size? And a way to guarantee its secure. Maybe a little mesh (strong mesh) window for air flow that can be closed from the outside like a tent window. That way you can have more secure ties at the opening to avoid escapees? Especially those ferrets

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That's good info re rabbits and backpacks. I've been looking at pet carrier backpacks because I'd like to be able to carry my cats and small dogs on my scooter. I'm also planning on adopting a baby rabbit and was hoping to pick it up using my scooter because transit access is poor where the breeder is.

What I've found so far is that there are plain fabric packs with NO support, then there are packs which are essentially hard pet carriers with backpack straps attached to them. That's what I'm planning to buy. It's just a question of finding one that's big enough and has proper backpack straps with chest and waist straps for stability when I make turns. Here's a sample of what I mean: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B0028ZCCCE/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20


Nowadays the "fashionable" backpack pet bags from China are hard shelled like a roller suitcase, with a clear plastic "bubble" for the pet to look out. The first time I saw one, I thought it was some sort of portable front load washer! The "bubble" comes with a mesh insert, you can switch out the bubble and use the mesh instead. They're quite small, but bigger versions (expensive) are available. Here's a sample: https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B01K70Y49A/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

As a side note, carrying a ferret around in a sugar glider style snuggle pack won't work. Ferrets are way too busy and active outside of their cages. They're not very snuggly creatures except when sleeping in their cages. For them, a snuggle sack is best used inside their cage, clipped to the bars. They love things like hammocks, snuggle sacks or snuggle cubes for sleeping. Outside the cage, they'll use them only when they get tired of running and playing.